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Author Topic: I am taking gamer satisfaction data and submitting it to different studios.  (Read 3592 times)

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cgmHDblog

CGMHD
I am taking gamer satisfaction data and submitti...
« on: February 17, 2011, 03:31:34 am »
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The purpose of this project is to give the gaming industry a well formatted database of information regarding how you feel about the current state of the gaming industry. A lot of people feel that their voices are not being heard. They feel that many game companies do not take the time to go out and ask the public what they want, how they feel and what they want to see improved.

What people need to understand is that this is a problem with many companies in many industries. As long as a company is making the amount of money they aim for they do not bother trying to ask the public what their concerns and suggestions are.

This project will allow me to help you get your opinions heard. I am going to personally take all the data I receive and submit it to various game companies and hope they take the time to go over it. I am also going to post general statistics here on my blog (if I can). I figure that if someone does the time consuming work for them and all they have to do is look at it then they just may take the time to read your opinion.

http://classicgamemusichd.blogspot.com/2011/02/community-project-1-informing-industry.html
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  • Classic Game Music HD
Re: I am taking gamer satisfaction data and subm...
« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2011, 04:35:11 am »
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But will the game industry care? The big publishers seem to be making money, and those are the ones who we'd want to reach the most.
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Mamoruanime

@Mamoruanime
Re: I am taking gamer satisfaction data and subm...
« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2011, 05:07:58 am »
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Well a couple of things;

1) Here's the deal- Game design is an art form. No matter how commercial it becomes, it's still art. It may have input, but you can't just "demand" that it's made the way you want it. It needs to be the artists vision.

2) They aren't hurting in sales. Why would it matter?

3) There are more indie companies than major companies. Buy their games if you want to help the industry.
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cgmHDblog

CGMHD
Re: I am taking gamer satisfaction data and subm...
« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2011, 05:28:50 am »
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Well a couple of things;

1) Here's the deal- Game design is an art form. No matter how commercial it becomes, it's still art. It may have input, but you can't just "demand" that it's made the way you want it. It needs to be the artists vision.

2) They aren't hurting in sales. Why would it matter?

3) There are more indie companies than major companies. Buy their games if you want to help the industry.

1) You're not demanding anything... well I guess that depends on how YOU write in the form. Remember, this is meant to be you voicing your opinion/making general suggestions on what you want to see and why you think it would make gaming better.

2) Actually they are hurting in sales. Maybe no where it actually hurts them financially but piracy does drop sales (obviously). A lot of people on community websites state that they pirate for various reasons. One of the most common reasons was that they are starting to hate how the company does business and/or develops games. This is where the form data comes in. You can tell them WHY they aren't getting your money or, if you don't pirate, simply why you are becoming upset with them.

3) Indie developers are more likely to listen to people. A lot of indie developers listen to you because they want to make a name for themselves. They make a game that meets the demands of most people. However, the big companies of today use to be great listening indie developers too. It's just now that their bank accounts are overflowing with money they mostly just copy their past ideas as much as possible (COD games being very similar with very little change for example)
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DJvenom

super-sage
Re: I am taking gamer satisfaction data and subm...
« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2011, 05:41:09 am »
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this project can have 2 outcomes, 1 of which is 99.9999999% more likely than the other.

1.) Your data is shot down outright, because big game companies don't give a crap what you think of their games, since they'll ALWAYS have a demographic.
2.) All of the game companies you submit your data to start making the same game.

Guess which one is more likely.

Hate to be a pessimist, but it's the truth. So long as there are 15-18 year olds to buy CoD games, you can bet your bottom dollar that they're gonna keep copy/pasting them. What you do as a gamer is find a company that makes games you enjoy. Don't expect every company to make them. It'd be like submitting a "What people like to eat." data sheet to every restaurant. The Italian restaurant isn't going to give 2 shits about customers who like eating Indian food, because that's why the Indian restaurant across the street exists. Sure they'd like the business, but they aren't going to start offering Indian food just for that reason, because then they're taking the risk of preparing Indian food and having the potential customers go to the other place to eat.
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I do art
I ermmm... DID do art
I do art

cgmHDblog

CGMHD
Re: I am taking gamer satisfaction data and subm...
« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2011, 05:57:52 am »
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Yes, I understand that. But when they do deny it then everyone who had me submit their opinion (which right now is 37 people and it hasn't even been up that long) will be VERY upset.

Think about this for a second. A single guy spends hours upon hours of his time collecting the opinions of your company and it's industry from people around the world. Said guy does this because he cares about the industry your company is a part of. Said "form fillers", AKA YOUR CUSTOMERS, also spend a good amount of time filling out said data.

Said guy organizes and sends the data. Various companies, including yours, receive said data. Companies in your industry can then make a choice. Said choice doesn't just effect 1 thing, it effects 2. Said effects are 1) Telling the customers "that's nice but !@#$% you we don't care" and 2) customers knowing you only care about the money and not presenting a quality product. Said effects cause you to lose reputation -> customers -> profit.

So in conclusion it is best for your company to consider said data. If you don't then many of your customers will hate you and most likely just pirate your games rather than buy them due to an "if its !@#$% us then !@#$% you" attitude.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2011, 05:59:29 am by cgmHDblog »
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Dantztron 3030

Mammy's Favorite Storyteller!
Re: I am taking gamer satisfaction data and subm...
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2011, 06:46:53 am »
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I really just don't think this is a very good idea, unless you were to get an extremely large sample. Game companies already have large research firms at their disposal that tell them more than you may think about gamers and the market they buy games in. And of course, they're not necessarily going to cater to the hardcore, at least the major publishers: they're going to make games that their research data tells them will sell.

You have really good intentions, but I honestly think this is a waste of time. Most gamers that want more out of bigger studios already have methods of finding games they want, be they indie games or older games.

EDIT: Also, you'll have an inherent sample bias sampling people in online forums and such, especially if said forums are for a particular developer or game series.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2011, 02:51:44 pm by Dantztron 3030 »
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well i dont have that system and it is very hard to care about everything when you are single
Re: I am taking gamer satisfaction data and subm...
« Reply #7 on: February 17, 2011, 07:13:21 am »
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Okay there are just a few things wrong with your idea.

1) Like Mammy said game development is an art. It is completely based on subjectivity and even the most minute things can have a great impact. Not to mention that if a great group of people don't like a game, it is because of various reasons. One aspect that is completely horrible to one group might be fantastic for another. Even when some aspects it is unanimous in that it is crap everyone has a different idea of making it better. You cannot make games that everyone likes.

2) Larger companies also have an exponential larger costs. Software design (and thus game design) is a labor intensive industry and not a material intensive industry. They need to pay a lot of people for something that you cannot even hold physically in your hands. They have to consider making high risk innovative projects that has to start the labor all from zero, or make income certain projects that have a lot of labor already done. Companies need to keep their heads floating. It is absolutely not the case that big companies have a lot of money in their bankaccounts. If they have one year then it is to compensate for the negative profits the next year. And if the income certain projects do not lead to certain income either they will scrap it as well. Take Guitar Hero for example. Even Nintendo decided not to paste the Mario franchise on everything anymore.

3) If you really don't like it you will not buy it. If you don't like the Wii's motion control, then don't buy the Wii. If you don't like CoD because there is no change then don't buy CoD. If you absolutely demand that Fifa, Madden and NHL updates its roster of players each year, than buy the games each year. As long as you buy, you make the statement that there is something about it that you still like.


Yes, I understand that. But when they do deny it then everyone who had me submit their opinion (which right now is 37 people and it hasn't even been up that long) will be VERY upset.
Wow 37 people. In a world with billions of people you need at least a 100 million people. If you are now already happy with 37 then you won't stand a chance.

Think about this for a second. A single guy claims to have spend hours upon hours of his time collecting the opinions of your company and it's industry from people around the world. Said guy claims to do this because he cares about the industry your company is a part of. Claimed "form fillers", AKA YOUR CUSTOMERS, also spend a good amount of time filling out said data.

Said guy claims to organize and send the data. Various companies, including yours, receive said data. Companies in your industry can then make a choice. Said choice doesn't just effect 1 thing, it effects 2. Said effects are 1) Telling the customers "that's nice but !@#$% you we don't care" and 2) customers knowing you only care about the money and not presenting a quality product. Said effects cause you to lose reputation -> customers -> profit.

So in conclusion it is best for your company to consider said data. If you don't then many of your customers will hate you and most likely just pirate your games rather than buy them due to an "if its !@#$% us then !@#$% you" attitude.
I think you are the one that has not thought this through. I fixed your post for you. Because look at it from a company's standpoint. Here is a guy claiming he has gathered oppinion of people, who claims that his report is the truth, the whole truth and nothing but th truth. He claims to have authentic forms of a remarkable number of people, which he cannot show because he either does not have them or he will go against the (inter)national statutes of privacy by submitting the data he got in confidence to third parties, making him an untrustworthy guy.

So unless you have the reputation of a good and trusted public opinion analyst or you work for a company that does professional public opinion analyses, the report that you will be lobbying is just as much worth as the paper it will be printed on. Without a reputation or a respectable background your word means nothing.

Oh and the work you will be doing won't be measured in 'hours', but in weeks, months or even years. Oh and big companies do gauge the public opinion through professional analyst companies, which do a lot of datamining from the internet. Even if it is just to save to keep their stock market shares up.






Oh yeah, I don't know who you are, nor do I know your reputation. You can claim a lot online, but I do not trust you with my data. You do not have the reputation of a professional.
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Mamoruanime

@Mamoruanime
Re: I am taking gamer satisfaction data and subm...
« Reply #8 on: February 17, 2011, 07:13:46 am »
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2) Actually they are hurting in sales.

Statistics? Source?

Protip: companies like EA reported an INCREASE of $3.5 billion in 2010. They're really hurting in sales. <_<
« Last Edit: February 17, 2011, 07:18:04 am by Mamoruアニメ »
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cgmHDblog

CGMHD
Re: I am taking gamer satisfaction data and subm...
« Reply #9 on: February 17, 2011, 03:32:34 pm »
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Okay there are just a few things wrong with your idea.

1) Like Mammy said game development is an art. It is completely based on subjectivity and even the most minute things can have a great impact. Not to mention that if a great group of people don't like a game, it is because of various reasons. One aspect that is completely horrible to one group might be fantastic for another. Even when some aspects it is unanimous in that it is crap everyone has a different idea of making it better. You cannot make games that everyone likes.

2) Larger companies also have an exponential larger costs. Software design (and thus game design) is a labor intensive industry and not a material intensive industry. They need to pay a lot of people for something that you cannot even hold physically in your hands. They have to consider making high risk innovative projects that has to start the labor all from zero, or make income certain projects that have a lot of labor already done. Companies need to keep their heads floating. It is absolutely not the case that big companies have a lot of money in their bankaccounts. If they have one year then it is to compensate for the negative profits the next year. And if the income certain projects do not lead to certain income either they will scrap it as well. Take Guitar Hero for example. Even Nintendo decided not to paste the Mario franchise on everything anymore.

3) If you really don't like it you will not buy it. If you don't like the Wii's motion control, then don't buy the Wii. If you don't like CoD because there is no change then don't buy CoD. If you absolutely demand that Fifa, Madden and NHL updates its roster of players each year, than buy the games each year. As long as you buy, you make the statement that there is something about it that you still like.

1) Apparently you guys don't know anything about business management. What does art have to do with the purpose of marketing? Nothing. The whole point of market research is to reach out to as many people as possible. Their "art" is based off your opinions about their past "art". And yes, it's impossible to make a product that everyone will like. Thank you so much for stating the obvious.

2) I honestly don't get your point will that paragraph. But in regards to a series such as guitar hero being scrapped I can say that it wasn't because people didn't like it, it was because they made so many iterations of it that it got old really fast. People didn't want to buy 3 guitar hero games a year. They DIDN'T LISTEN TO PEOPLE when they complained about guitar hero games coming out too often. The fact they DIDNT LISTEN TO YOUR OPINION ABOUT THEIR BUSINESS is what made that series ultimately fail.

3) Again, there isn't really an overall point you're making with this. Obviously you're not going to buy something if you don't like it. At the same time, just because you bought it doesn't mean you don't think there are a lot of improvements that need to be made.

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Wow 37 people. In a world with billions of people you need at least a 100 million people. If you are now already happy with 37 then you won't stand a chance.

Really? Okay smart ass. You obviously missed the whole point of that comment. Is 37 people little? Yes. But 37 people in 10 minutes is a lot. Obviously, unlike you, a lot of people want the industry to get better and agree that the idea behind this project is a good one. By the way, the count is now above 1,300. Hasn't even been 24 hours. Thank you for showing your intelligence level once more.

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Oh yeah, I don't know who you are, nor do I know your reputation. You can claim a lot online, but I do not trust you with my data. You do not have the reputation of a professional.

So what you are saying is that you don't trust me knowing your opinion on games... yet you post those opinions here, and I'm sure other sites as well, where people like me, the "non-professional scary potential scammers", can take your comments and... well I honestly don't know what I would do with them that would harm you in any way.

Statistics? Source?

Hurting sales doesn't always have to mean the project lost money (no profit). What it can mean, and what I meant, is that they are losing additional sales. A lot of companies complain about this. Crysis 2 being leaked? Yeah, I'm pretty sure there were thousands of comments from gamers telling people not to pirate the game because they know that Crytek will drop their PC support (which they did say they will do BTW). Hence the reason they focused Crysis 2 on consoles so much.



I can't believe how unintelligent and rude you people have responded to this. Consider this my last post here. (don't bother saying "like omg yay!" because I already know)
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  • Classic Game Music HD
Re: I am taking gamer satisfaction data and subm...
« Reply #10 on: February 17, 2011, 04:30:19 pm »
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Well, if you do not like the response you get, then I guess you can cry about it and leave like a child.
Personally, I believe games that are made based upon customer feedback is based upon the sales of said game.
Then again, it doesn't mean anything.

Initial release seems to equal whatever the company wants.
Patches/Updates is whatever the customer base is bitching about(looking at SC2/maybe WoW as examples).
Not talking about glitch ptaches but like unbalanced gameplay, exploits, etc.

Oh and what Niek said
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Oh yeah, I don't know who you are, nor do I know your reputation. You can claim a lot online, but I do not trust you with my data. You do not have the reputation of a professional.

Good-bye from the forums. 

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Xiphirx

wat
Re: I am taking gamer satisfaction data and subm...
« Reply #11 on: February 17, 2011, 05:22:08 pm »
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I can't believe how unintelligent and rude you people have responded to this. Consider this my last post here. (don't bother saying "like omg yay!" because I already know)

Sorry, I just read the whole topic and it seems like you cannot take criticism. You were the only one with a rude attitude.

Sorry that you feel that you must leave. Take care.


Oh and what Niek said
Quote
Oh yeah, I don't know who you are, nor do I know your reputation. You can claim a lot online, but I do not trust you with my data. You do not have the reputation of a professional.

Good-bye from the forums. 

Uncalled for.
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Mamoruanime

@Mamoruanime
Re: I am taking gamer satisfaction data and subm...
« Reply #12 on: February 17, 2011, 07:10:42 pm »
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Statistics? Source?

Hurting sales doesn't always have to mean the project lost money (no profit). What it can mean, and what I meant, is that they are losing additional sales. A lot of companies complain about this. Crysis 2 being leaked? Yeah, I'm pretty sure there were thousands of comments from gamers telling people not to pirate the game because they know that Crytek will drop their PC support (which they did say they will do BTW). Hence the reason they focused Crysis 2 on consoles so much.

Okay; so here's a breakdown of your reply to me requesting statistics and sources:

*general reply saying "it does not!"*
*completely unrelated information about a game leak*

... And you promise an organized database? This is why they won't even look at you in the first place. You can't even provide statistics to prove *why* there's an issue with the gaming industry.

If you want to go to history of sales vs game leaks: Half Life 2. Oh hey that game wasn't a success or anything.
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Re: I am taking gamer satisfaction data and subm...
« Reply #13 on: February 17, 2011, 07:36:58 pm »
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Oh and what Niek said
Quote
Oh yeah, I don't know who you are, nor do I know your reputation. You can claim a lot online, but I do not trust you with my data. You do not have the reputation of a professional.

Good-bye from the forums. 

Uncalled for.


Because I said "Good-bye"?
He said he wasn't coming back...So I said good-bye.  If I was really trying to be a DICK I would have put other words in place.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2011, 07:39:21 pm by Theforeshadower »
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Xiphirx

wat
Re: I am taking gamer satisfaction data and subm...
« Reply #14 on: February 17, 2011, 09:38:35 pm »
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Oh and what Niek said
Quote
Oh yeah, I don't know who you are, nor do I know your reputation. You can claim a lot online, but I do not trust you with my data. You do not have the reputation of a professional.

Good-bye from the forums. 

Uncalled for.


Because I said "Good-bye"?
He said he wasn't coming back...So I said good-bye.  If I was really trying to be a DICK I would have put other words in place.

It just comes off as confrontational, its nothing too serious, but I sense a bad vibe forming in this topic.

Yes, I have spidey senses. :D
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DJvenom

super-sage
Re: I am taking gamer satisfaction data and subm...
« Reply #15 on: February 18, 2011, 06:35:41 am »
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I tried to be nice. I even simplified what I meant with a common analogy.
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I do art
I ermmm... DID do art
I do art

Mamoruanime

@Mamoruanime
Re: I am taking gamer satisfaction data and subm...
« Reply #16 on: February 18, 2011, 01:36:07 pm »
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I tried to be nice. I even simplified what I meant with a common analogy.

Lol, well everyone was still a million times nicer than any game dev company would be :P It would basically go like this:

"Some punk ass kid got 50 people to fill out a form saying what they want in a game!"
"What? Why? We have firms that bring us tens of thousands of completed surveys from people."
"So what should we do with his data?"
"Make a game to spite him."
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