ZFGC
ZFGC.com => Updates => Topic started by: bertfallen on November 16, 2008, 05:43:14 pm
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If ZFGC were to have an official part of the staff dedicated to setting up events, handling news items, etc., would you be interested in being a part of it?
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I'd like to handle the news items and stuff, although I wouldn't be on all the time. Still, a dedicated part of the staff is a good idea, and I think it should be instituted. Would help out immensely, I'm sure.
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Does 4sword NOT already do this? It's obvious that he does it since his name is in the topics, so seriously I don't think a seperate rank should be made, since apparently it was a pain in the ass just to make "The Pumpkin King" rank, which has no special permissions. Event staff should just be made local mods on the boards they need to be and then they can sticky/move topics as deemed necessary. And before you think I'm being pesimistic about this, This is just my opinion. People volunteered to set up news reports and weekly magazines, they weren't appointed. If you don't want to do these things without some special rank, step aside and let someone who WANTS to do it without any special recognization. Just my opinion though. I would be happy to be in 4sword's position, being able to write the magazine for a forum like ZFGC, but I wasn't chosen. Giving the event staff a seperate rank would seperate them from non-staff members, which would take the whole "community-run" community feel out of the forum, also.
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Does 4sword NOT already do this? It's obvious that he does it since his name is in the topics, so seriously I don't think a seperate rank should be made, since apparently it was a pain in the ass just to make "The Pumpkin King" rank, which has no special permissions. Event staff should just be made local mods on the boards they need to be and then they can sticky/move topics as deemed necessary. And before you think I'm being pesimistic about this, This is just my opinion. People volunteered to set up news reports and weekly magazines, they weren't appointed. If you don't want to do these things without some special rank, step aside and let someone who WANTS to do it without any special recognization. Just my opinion though. I would be happy to be in 4sword's position, being able to write the magazine for a forum like ZFGC, but I wasn't chosen. Giving the event staff a seperate rank would seperate them from non-staff members, which would take the whole "community-run" community feel out of the forum, also.
QFT'd
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Zidane used to help, I asked Darklight to help me out and he did not respond even though he was on for a few hours after I sent him the PM, and bertfallen kind of helps me with this now. This instablility is often counter-productive and it would be beneficial to have people helping me who would have the same primary goal. The problem now is that volunteers who work for the site have no place to effectively collaborate nor do they have a way of actively working with the moderators to do certain necessary things.
By having a more concentrated work force, the news would be better, there would be more variety in such news, the events would happen without being rushed to a point of irrelevancy, etc. As for the Pumpkin King rank, perhaps I am rusty with how SMF works, but setting it up should not have been that difficult - really all it is a custom rank that has the same permissions as a regular member. If a staff person were to have it as their rank, their staff ranks could be set to primary so nothing really would have changed for them.
This ranking would also make it a lot easier to communicate with the administration in that, for example, I would not have to make proposals each and every time I had an idea that had some thought in it and send it via PM to them. By being in the staff, these things could be discussed and decided upon more efficiently. It would also make it so I was not doing most if not all of the work.
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The problem now is that volunteers who work for the site have no place to effectively collaborate nor do they have a way of actively working with the moderators to do certain necessary things. I agree that event staff shouldn't have to rely on moderators to do things as simple as moving topics or closing them. In the same breath, I don't agree that a seperate rank should be made for permissions that local mods can already do.
Thats why I said to make them staff of necessary board.
This ranking would also make it a lot easier to communicate with the administration in that, for example, I would not have to make proposals each and every time I had an idea that had some thought in it and send it via PM to them.
Pitching ideas in community speak usually gets the best feedback. I don't see how making event staff mods would make communicating with infini any more efficient. He doesn't read PM's from mods quicker then from regular members, I'm sure. Also, I think running ideas by the community to see if they're as good as you think they might be. Personal Icons and zoomable pictures were good examples of this.
Not trying to nitpick. I'm just saying, lots of people have ideas, and I personally think they should just come out with them and post them in community speak because you never know if your idea might be what brings this community closer together. Just pitching it to infini doesn't guarantee it will happen, but if you pitch it to infini backed with a post that has a bunch of members saying "DO IT!" your idea may be more likely to come to fruition :)
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Making them staff of a necessary board isn't a good solution because often there are multiple boards which require staffing. Thus the operational, public boards have to be locally moderated and the planning, hidden boards have to be locally moderated - anywhere else requires those working on events and such to PM a moderator to get things done and for whatever reason the moderators are slow, don't really care, or are busy. I shouldn't have to ask someone something every time just to get the same thing done.
If I were to pitch ideas more and more in places such as Community Speak then that would ultimately lead to people wondering why the hell I was not on the staff already or why the staff were not able to really do this themselves. The communication for what I was proposed was internal, with event staffers conversing amongst themselves and the moderation for things that they needed - and by any measure, it is better than the current system.
As for getting responses back from Infini, I know that he is busy, but in reality, he is the only administrator who is ever really on this place who isn't hidden. I know that he posts some of my ideas in the staff area, but I also know that the moderations response to even that is slow. It isn't so much just about what the community thinks is cool so much as it is what ZFGC can offer those who come here.
The funny thing is that your last point favors popularity rather than practicality. A popular idea doesn't always work, especially if the negative aspects are neglected.
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People can locally mod more then 1 board.
Also, my last statement doesn't favor popularity. It's simply saying ask members if they think it's a good idea first. This is an example. My idea might be to have a dropbox in he bottom corner of the forum that lets you quick-select your theme. I pitch it to infini, who let's say browses with google chrome. The script works fine in google chrome, and firefox, but causes the forum to be un-browsable in IE or Opera. Now what if I would have pitched it to the whole forum first? There would have been replies like "Hey, that script doesnt work in IE, or Opera." thus they would have been against it...
I'm not promoting bandwagoning. Just having stuff run by the community BEFORE it's run by staff... Otherwise they're gonna get flooded with some ideas that are completely stupid, like quick-selecting theme drop boxes. Also makes it seem like the staff is changing the forum without consulting the community either.
for whatever reason the moderators are slow, don't really care, or are busy.
I'm pretty sure they care about the forum, but moving a topic that can be moved after responding to a reported offensive topic usually tends to fall to the bottom of the priority list. That's why I'm saying Event staff need to simply be local modded on all necessary forums. As in ALL the ones you'd need to move/delete stuff from... Not just some of them. ALL of them.
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I know that people can locally moderate more than one board, it just looks dumb when there is one person moderating more than one board over a single, certain thing. It's a clutter to have my name plastered all over the top part of the forum, even under something that is official, and yet I am not official. The reason you do not see this as so bad is simply because I am doing a lot. If I acted like a normal person and divvied up responsibility amongst multiple people, then there would be more than one local moderators of different boards all for the sake of a simple, certain thing. And still, they would have nowhere to collaborate with themselves or with the moderation easily.
It is not as if ideas would not be run by the community, in fact, they are and have been. The Halloween Contest idea was essentially derived from what I had posted in Feedback and I owe Q.K. for the ideas of progressing it further. To have people working on the idea though and actually putting it through its paces so that there is an actual result rather than just a concept, you need people would are committed to working on it. And you're forgetting that the news really doesn't have to be run through the community each time an item pops up for it, rather, it just has to be actively updated to be viable on some level.
If you are worried about the staff getting run with ideas that are stupid, then having an events staff would at least make it so that the other staff would not have to sift through those ideas as they have other things to do. It someone had an idea, then the event staff could look into it and formulate its viability before it was proposed to a higher level.
And for some of your last example, not all ideas would be handled by the events staff, such as forum functionality. I don't know where you are going with that.
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/me sighs
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I'm not even gonna bother defending myself, because you're just gonna !@#$% nitpick anything I say opposing it to death. I'm obviously oblivious to how hard coordinating forum events are because I never had to do it before. Congrats on mod, 4sword, because you apparently aren't going to !@#$% shut up about it until it happens... And why shouldn't you be mod? You've spent about 1/3 of your life on this forum! :) So again, Congrats!
Date Registered: April 01, 2006
Current Date: November 16, 2008
Total Time Spent Online: 309 days, 20 hours and 31 minutes.
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Allow me to add my thoughts to this mix:
Shut the !@#$% up and stop nitpicking everything, 4Sword. The question of the week is on what peoples' thoughts on it are. This isn't a !@#$% debate topic about whether or not it should be done.
Thank you.
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If ZFGC were to have an official part of the staff dedicated to setting up events, handling news items, etc., would you be interested in being a part of it?
I recall doing it once. -- The Events team. It didn't work out so well.
It worked best when staff as a whole suggested ideas and ran their own suggestions.. and it works fine... when users do the same.
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I'm not even gonna bother defending myself, because you're just gonna !@#$% nitpick anything I say opposing it to death. I'm obviously oblivious to how hard coordinating forum events are because I never had to do it before. Congrats on mod, 4sword, because you apparently aren't going to !@#$% shut up about it until it happens... And why shouldn't you be mod? You've spent about 1/3 of your life on this forum! :) So again, Congrats!
Date Registered: April 01, 2006
Current Date: November 16, 2008
Total Time Spent Online: 309 days, 20 hours and 31 minutes.
It's funny because right in your first sentence you insinuated that I was attacking you, and then in your last sentence you go on attacking me although all I have been going after on you was the validity and relevancy of your ideas. Nit-picking would be picking just one or a few things and then using that in an argument, but I was going after every idea that I came into disagreement with and saying why I thought it has not worked. If I wrote any less wordy, there would be a loss of meaning.
Overall, users here have ideas, but there are certain users who are more vocal about their ideas than others. There are users who will just agree because they like the person voicing the idea, and that really does not strengthen the idea all that much. It goes to be that moderators and the staff were supposed to be handling contests and events though, and that almost all and died here. I just think by having a group of people who can work with themselves in a space where those moderators that feel they can help are willing to, that that would be a good thing.
Allow me to add my thoughts to this mix:
Shut the !@#$% up and stop nitpicking everything, 4Sword. The question of the week is on what peoples' thoughts on it are. This isn't a !@#$% debate topic about whether or not it should be done.
Thank you.
There is nothing wrong with how I have posted in this topic other than it bothers some people to read that much. And besides, this topic has gotten more replies this way which is good for it.
If ZFGC were to have an official part of the staff dedicated to setting up events, handling news items, etc., would you be interested in being a part of it?
I recall doing it once. -- The Events team. It didn't work out so well.
It worked best when staff as a whole suggested ideas and ran their own suggestions.. and it works fine... when users do the same.
It is not as if I wasn't there for that. it failed due to a lack of ideas and lack of things to do. With the site there is more to do that requires people. One cannot just apply the past as a be-all end-all result of something that would be attempted later. If everything was the same, then I would agree, but it is not. There is z3, NCFC, news items, holiday contests, gaming tournaments, etc. to set up, with a site to help out, and thus I feel that an events staff would be viable now.
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Easy_D's easy solutions.
Make your own god damn forum.
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If ZFGC were to have an official part of the staff dedicated to setting up events, handling news items, etc., would you be interested in being a part of it?
I recall doing it once. -- The Events team. It didn't work out so well.
It worked best when staff as a whole suggested ideas and ran their own suggestions.. and it works fine... when users do the same.
It is not as if I wasn't there for that. it failed due to a lack of ideas and lack of things to do. With the site there is more to do that requires people. One cannot just apply the past as a be-all end-all result of something that would be attempted later. If everything was the same, then I would agree, but it is not. There is z3, NCFC, news items, holiday contests, gaming tournaments, etc. to set up, with a site to help out, and thus I feel that an events staff would be viable now.
We have had an events staff more than just once. MANY times, in fact. They all failed in proportions so epic it can only be compared to Hitler's campaign in World War 2.
Easy_D's easy solutions.
Make your own god damn forum.
QFT'd.
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Without really reading what you said minus 'i'. - I don't specifically think I was talking about -you-. I didn't realize this topic was about *you*. I'm in no way attempting to 'troll' the topic, but jesus? I was answering bert's question.
We never had success with an events team, ever. z3 never happened. NCFC is NOT ours to organize, nor did we have a major part in the organization of it (aside from Windfyre providing chat hosting). Possum was the events manager, he poofed. Tara was the events manager, she poofed. The only good events admin we had that was never declared one, aside from unofficially, was Mammy.. he took care of !@#$% got !@#$% done. Helios has also had much success with it.
I'd love to give a raw unfiltered opinion on the matter-- but that's not what this topic is about, the topic is about answering berts question, which no one is having success with doing, it's all being taken personally.. which isn't the purpose of these openended questions.. the goal is to seek feedback.
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Just a quick question...
How much longer are you going to go on about not being a mod or not having some sort of power?
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Easy_D's easy solutions.
Make your own god damn forum.
Sounds good to me.
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Oh, these guys are mad.
Serious business.
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If ZFGC were to have an official part of the staff dedicated to setting up events, handling news items, etc., would you be interested in being a part of it?
I recall doing it once. -- The Events team. It didn't work out so well.
It worked best when staff as a whole suggested ideas and ran their own suggestions.. and it works fine... when users do the same.
It is not as if I wasn't there for that. it failed due to a lack of ideas and lack of things to do. With the site there is more to do that requires people. One cannot just apply the past as a be-all end-all result of something that would be attempted later. If everything was the same, then I would agree, but it is not. There is z3, NCFC, news items, holiday contests, gaming tournaments, etc. to set up, with a site to help out, and thus I feel that an events staff would be viable now.
We have had an events staff more than just once. MANY times, in fact. They all failed in proportions so epic it can only be compared to Hitler's campaign in World War 2.
Easy_D's easy solutions.
Make your own god damn forum.
QFT'd.
Hitlers campaign was actually near succedding though. :P
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I'm not permitted to leak, but I can say that this question IS about 4sword. Just believe me there.
Also,
If you volunteer to help a website out, you shouldn't do it EXPECTING a special title, or for them to make you a special forum to organize your activities. You should go into the job KNOWING it's going to be hard, and if the website gives you a special rank or anything, hey... congrats! I honestlt can't see writing a weekly article that is basically you taking quotes from the forum, linking to topics on the forum, linking to a game on the forum, and writing a short interview you send to the game creator to have them email back can be all that tough. It really should also be bi-monthly to ensure a bit better quality, as well as make sure everything is up to par, since there are more weeks in a year then there are worthwhile games on this forum... No offense.
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Oh, these guys are mad.
Serious business.
(http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/234933/SeriousCat.jpg)
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If ZFGC were to have an official part of the staff dedicated to setting up events, handling news items, etc., would you be interested in being a part of it?
I recall doing it once. -- The Events team. It didn't work out so well.
It worked best when staff as a whole suggested ideas and ran their own suggestions.. and it works fine... when users do the same.
It is not as if I wasn't there for that. it failed due to a lack of ideas and lack of things to do. With the site there is more to do that requires people. One cannot just apply the past as a be-all end-all result of something that would be attempted later. If everything was the same, then I would agree, but it is not. There is z3, NCFC, news items, holiday contests, gaming tournaments, etc. to set up, with a site to help out, and thus I feel that an events staff would be viable now.
We have had an events staff more than just once. MANY times, in fact. They all failed in proportions so epic it can only be compared to Hitler's campaign in World War 2.
Easy_D's easy solutions.
Make your own god damn forum.
QFT'd.
Hitlers campaign was actually near succedding though. :P
But it still fell short because the leader, in the end, turned out to be !@#$% retarded. Point and case.
Can we get back to the subject at hand, rather than this giant circle bent on kicking each other in the balls?
My opinion: An Events Staff has failed every time before. I say no, until sufficient proof can be given that it will not be an utter flop.
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If it -is- about 4sword. A question like this should not be presented to the users, it's unfair.
Also, taking the question at it's context, I'm still going to have to say -no-.
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And a question like this is obviously going to get filled with members saying "YES, I'LL HELP!" and eventually it will be put into motion, then 4sword will get his special rank. It's too easy to see what's going on here after having seen some of the recent conversations elsewhere.
4sword pitches him getting a special staff rank. Staff doesn't act on it, and now a question pops up in ZFGC Weekly (written by 4sword) asking the forum if there should be a special staff rank.
Who is favoring popularity over practicality now?
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Hitler was improving near the end of the war, but his mental health and the fact that his forces had pretty much neared defeat anyway is what sealed the deal. An example of his improvement would be the introduction of the jet-propelled aircraft to the aerial fleet; they were faster, just it was too late to make much of a difference.
As for what Vash said, I was there as a user, I was able to read information about past events, and I was there for at least one events team failure. I know why it failed - mainly due to those not having anything to do and the fact that the two most active were at the top. With the site now and a preoccupied moderation and administration, it is not as if there would be too little to do. Infini would still have authority over everything that the events staff would do, and it's establishment would serve to give everyone more convenience. Also, the only reason bertfallen posted this is because I was not able to and sticky it; I asked him to post this as the person helping me stopped.
As for what DJvenom said, the Weekly itself would not really be benefited on that time scale. It would essentially just give one person more time to work on it. I can see where it would help out in terms of running out of things to talk about and it would make for more content to put into it, but really, for one person to do more with that is just asking too much of one person. I don't know, I mean, I am in college, !@#$%'s busy. The chat has special ranking here anyway which is a little silly. After Dantz left, he put me into a "Staff" category, but then that was later taken away anyway, meh.
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What was this topic about again :huh: :huh: :huh: :huh: :huh: :huh: :huh: :huh: :huh: :huh:
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Hitler was improving near the end of the war, but his mental health and the fact that his forces had pretty much neared defeat anyway is what sealed the deal. An example of his improvement would be the introduction of the jet-propelled aircraft to the aerial fleet; they were faster, just it was too late to make much of a difference.
Because you obviously missed it, I was alluding to the fact that you are acting !@#$% retarded and are just after gaining some special status to look like you're better than somebody, which is made obvious by the fact that you are making this topic about you.
I don't know, I mean, I am in college, !@#$%'s busy. The chat has special ranking here anyway which is a little silly.
That's because the Chat has official standing with the forums, as part of the community. Chat is not managed by the community. Events should be.
After Dantz left, he put me into a "Staff" category, but then that was later taken away anyway, meh.
See? This is totally about you getting status.
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What was this topic about again :huh: :huh: :huh: :huh: :huh: :huh: :huh: :huh: :huh: :huh:
I think it's about 4Sword's aspiration to be like Hitler.
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Look, all I really want is the ability to work with people rather than doing !@#$% all by myself, all the time. The last point involving Dantz was just me saying how that was fine then, which brings up why should it be so frowned upon now?
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Trolling by the administration. Fun stuff.
The chat has special ranking here anyway which is a little silly.
Silly like making volunteers moderators simply because they ask to be, using ZFGC Weekly as a cover because the administration's too stupid to realize when they're being manipulated, right? I'm sick of this whole thing.
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Look, all I really want is the ability to work with people rather than doing !@#$% all by myself, all the time. The last point involving Dantz was just me saying how that was fine then, which brings up why should it be so frowned upon now?
You can work with other people without a rank you know.
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Trolling by the administration. Fun stuff.
The chat has special ranking here anyway which is a little silly.
Silly like making volunteers moderators simply because they ask to be, using ZFGC Weekly as a cover because the administration's too stupid to realize when they're being manipulated, right? I'm sick of this whole thing.
<3 Wally
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Look, all I really want is the ability to work with people rather than doing !@#$% all by myself, all the time. The last point involving Dantz was just me saying how that was fine then, which brings up why should it be so frowned upon now?
Frowned upon now because that was Dantz assigning you staff position, and now it's you BEGGING for staff position. And obviously it wasn't fine then or they WOULDN'T HAVE REMOVED IT!
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Zidane used to help, I asked Darklight to help me out and he did not respond even though he was on for a few hours after I sent him the PM, and bertfallen kind of helps me with this now. This instablility is often counter-productive and it would be beneficial to have people helping me who would have the same primary goal. The problem now is that volunteers who work for the site have no place to effectively collaborate nor do they have a way of actively working with the moderators to do certain necessary things.
By having a more concentrated work force, the news would be better, there would be more variety in such news, the events would happen without being rushed to a point of irrelevancy, etc. As for the Pumpkin King rank, perhaps I am rusty with how SMF works, but setting it up should not have been that difficult - really all it is a custom rank that has the same permissions as a regular member. If a staff person were to have it as their rank, their staff ranks could be set to primary so nothing really would have changed for them.
This ranking would also make it a lot easier to communicate with the administration in that, for example, I would not have to make proposals each and every time I had an idea that had some thought in it and send it via PM to them. By being in the staff, these things could be discussed and decided upon more efficiently. It would also make it so I was not doing most if not all of the work.
reason I didn't respond was because I was busy doing stuff elsewhere and just left my computer going. Guess I shouldn't really do that, it gives people the wrong impression of things.
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You people all assume that just because I am methodical and coldly rational that it is sufficient to say that I am evil and/or sitting, grinning, with my fingers wiggling as if to suggest I was diabolically thinking. As for volunteers being moderators, I do not follow, but to manage any event, having a little local moderator power is useful. When there is something spread across multiple boards though, having some attributes of a global moderator would be more practical than assigning a person to each board as a local moderator.
And duh, I know I can work with people without a rank, and I have. I have to work with some ranked people as well as they have abilities that I do not. It would be helpful to have an area where unranked people at least could have conversation rather than intermittently via PM which you really cannot do easily between three people or more if you ever have that many.
Oh, and Darklight, sorry about that. It wasn't so much directed at you as the occasions arise often when I run into that situation, you being the last of said situation.
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You people all assume that just because I am methodical and coldly rational that it is sufficient to say that I am evil and/or sitting, grinning, with my fingers wiggling as if to suggest I was diabolically thinking.
Actually, I just imagine some fatass who has no friends offline who feels a need to have status on an internet community so that he can feel better than his tormenters elsewhere, and seeks to accomplish said goal by pushing for some completely unrelated status.
Tell me, why was it, exactly, that you got stripped of the Events Staff lead before? And why should you be in charge now? Why are you pushing so hard for this, when it will accomplish nothing more than you having a pretty little sign under your name?
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You people all assume that just because I am methodical and coldly rational that it is sufficient to say that I am evil and/or sitting, grinning, with my fingers wiggling as if to suggest I was diabolically thinking.
Actually, I just imagine some fatass who has no friends offline who feels a need to have status on an internet community so that he can feel better than his tormenters elsewhere, and seeks to accomplish said goal by pushing for some completely unrelated status.
Tell me, why was it, exactly, that you got stripped of the Events Staff lead before? And why should you be in charge now? Why are you pushing so hard for this, when it will accomplish nothing more than you having a pretty little sign under your name?
I wasn't the Event Staff lead, I was the Moderation Lead. I was around when Hoffy and NeoGeo-x both got co-adminship of that. And as I have stated previously, I just want to be able to work with people, and that Infini would be in charge.
I am not actually fat, although occasionally constipated, but oh well. I just see that if I am going to be here, I may as well try to do my part for the hell of it considering that hardly anyone else even in groups seems to want to do the same.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v79/sven_kola/motivator1227907.jpg)
Oh, and that made me chuckle. I like the one with Newton talking about deriving while you derive as well.
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Things getting out of hand, etc.
Locked.
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God !@#$% damnit, why the hell is the weekly question being used to push an agenda? Bert, you know better than to do this sort of stuff, and you know exactly what I'm talking about.
This is getting ridiculous kids.
Bert; stop pushing the issue about 4Sword being staff. You're the only one doing it, and it's getting old quick. This thread is a good example of why it's getting old; check out the responses. It's an abuse of your status. You as someone who is familiar with the military should know you don't try to undercut higher ranks. It's been made blatantly clear from the administration that it's not going to happen. So give it a rest.
4Sword; Yes, you do a lot for the forum, and yes, you're involved in the community, but you just don't know how to handle opposing opinions, and that's where the issue is. It's impossible to have a civil discussion with you because you're constantly trying to prove that you're always right. Just because you think it's correct, and it seems logical to you doesn't mean it's correct at all. Sometimes you just have to settle. Besides. A person's logic isn't always correct anyway, since it's often the person's opinion of what logic should be. Usually if you have to ask to be on staff (especially hint at it as gratuitously as you have), then you're not going to make it on staff. I hate to sound like an !@#$%, but man, you need to find other things to do. With that statement, I should also add that just because you're on a whole bunch doesn't mean you're more qualified as staff than the existing staff. You need to work well with others to be good on staff... And frankly that's always been the issue.