Hello Guest, please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
Login with username, password and session length.

Pages: 1 [2]   Go Down

Author Topic: Selling Game Maker games on Steam... wait, WHAT?  (Read 17443 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Mamoruanime

@Mamoruanime
Re: Selling Game Maker games on Steam... wait, W...
« Reply #20 on: February 21, 2012, 07:54:24 pm »
  • ^Not actually me.
  • *
  • Reputation: +9/-0
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Posts: 9786
I think it's best not to boast about programming ability when you really don't understand what you're getting into or talking about... No offense.

It'd be like me boasting knowledge of C++ just because I tinkered with some code. I know !@#$% about C++, and I definitely wouldn't get cocky and say I do just because I've "played around in it a bit"

What Infini said is the bare-bones truth; GM teaches bad practices. It took years to "deprogram" myself from the !@#$% GM imposes on coding practices.
Logged

Jeod

Team Dekunutz, Doubleteam
Re: Selling Game Maker games on Steam... wait, W...
« Reply #21 on: February 21, 2012, 08:14:59 pm »
  • *
  • Reputation: +3/-0
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Posts: 1675
There's no need to completely bash at GM-origin games being sold on Steam. If I wanted to make indie games as a hobby I'd probably go that route just because I don't want to learn C++. It's a hobby, not a career. If I want to make a few extra bucks on the side of my unrelated career, what's the problem?

Development is an elitist industry, I'll give Infini that. But when the elitist attitude carries over to society and bashes people using an "inferior software" just to make a few quick bucks, it becomes disgusting.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2012, 08:16:47 pm by Jeod »
Logged
"You should challenge your fates. When all else fails, you can still die fighting." ~Yune
___________________________________

Zelda GBC+ Engine for Multimedia Fusion 2
  • Doubleteam Project Page
Re: Selling Game Maker games on Steam... wait, W...
« Reply #22 on: February 21, 2012, 08:24:31 pm »
  • *
  • Reputation: +3/-0
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Posts: 6629
I'm not bashing anything, I'm just being honest about its shortcomings, I even praised it for being a good way to entice people into game development.
Logged

Jeod

Team Dekunutz, Doubleteam
Re: Selling Game Maker games on Steam... wait, W...
« Reply #23 on: February 21, 2012, 08:25:33 pm »
  • *
  • Reputation: +3/-0
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Posts: 1675
I'm not bashing anything, I'm just being honest about its shortcomings, I even praised it for being a good way to entice people into game development.

That wasn't directed at you so much as the industry itself. Example: Zelda Universe community, like KT mentioned in his original post.
Logged
"You should challenge your fates. When all else fails, you can still die fighting." ~Yune
___________________________________

Zelda GBC+ Engine for Multimedia Fusion 2
  • Doubleteam Project Page
Re: Selling Game Maker games on Steam... wait, W...
« Reply #24 on: February 21, 2012, 11:04:30 pm »
  • AKA "Micah DS"
  • *
  • Reputation: +9/-0
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Posts: 1347
Would people really pay for crap made in game maker?

Hell i was surprised when that RPGMaker looking game call of chthululululu sold on steam.

I wouldn't pay for "crap", but I would pay for an enjoyable and well-made game, even if it was made with Game Maker.

To be honest, I've never seen a Game Maker game that I'd pay for. But, to be fair, most Game Maker games are made by people that aren't trying to sell. Money motivates. Therefore, it doesn't exactly seem logical to judge Game Maker on fan-made games, or even any freeware Game Maker game. In some cases, I've seen people trying to sell GM games on their own websites, and even those sucked, but it was obviously not Game Maker's fault, it was the developer's fault. The problems were in the graphics, the story, the mechanics, etc. It's clear that they didn't know enough about using Game Maker properly and efficiently.
And it's not just Game Maker games that can suck. I've seen my fair share of other crappy games that were programmed in a "real" programming language.

Point is: It's not completely about what you use to make the game. You've got to have the right skills and the knowledge to make a good game as well, or your game will fail no matter what language it's been coded with.

I really wouldn't get your hopes up though guys, steam is notoriously restrictive over what they allow into the store, your only real way as an indie is to already have an large established community around the game - as most indie games on steam have.

Send a message to the steamworks support team, and they will give you a brief overview of the TRC they require before releasing games on steam.

No one should ever hope to get anywhere if they don't work hard. I plan to work hard to get my game on Steam. I'm making my game with Game Maker to speed up development by a few years, since I know GML fairly well and it would take me a very long time to learn a more professional coding language.

That said, I don't plan on making use of Game Maker as most people do (as I also have in the past, even with the Spirit's Quest engine). I wouldn't expect to get far at all if I did. A good example of poor GM use is how common it is for people to place tons of solid collision objects within a room, when usually a simple 2d array of "solids" can take care of all those collisions. Cutting down the number of objects is a great first step in using GM efficiently. I go by the rule that "Less objects is more". Another thing most GM users overlook is proper loading and unloading of resources. The trick is to only store what you need in the game itself. If you must, just encrypt the external files (i.e. sprites, music, sounds) and load them and unload them at the proper times. This decreases the initial loading time immensely, and it should free up a bit of memory as well. The biggest flaw I've found in GM games, including mine, is that they are needlessly bloated. If GM is used right, I think it's very possible to make a professional feeling game that runs fast, looks good, feels good, is fun to play, and that will ultimately sell well.

As far as having a "large established community" around the game: I think that, if your game is good enough, that will happen mostly on it's own. Of course you need to get your game out there in the world by use of forums, YouTube, an official website, by submitting your game in to the IGF or by plugging in at any indie game expo you can, etc. If your game is good, your target audience will like it and they will support it, if not, they won't.
Logged
  • My Music
Re: Selling Game Maker games on Steam... wait, W...
« Reply #25 on: February 22, 2012, 12:34:48 am »
  • ...---^^^---...
  • *
  • Reputation: +6/-0
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Posts: 616
^^  Agreed!  Often times people dog on Game Maker because there are so many steaming piles of crap out there, that people try to pass off as a game, that are made with game maker.  In reality Game Maker made it possible for these people, who would have never even been able to code an if statement in their lives, to make these piles of crap resembling games.  Although Game Maker is not as efficient as other "Real" programming languages, in the hands of someone who has the patience, desire, and motivation necessary to make a good game, I see no reason why a masterpiece could not be made with game maker.  Will it take time and a lot of motivation.  Yes, but so does making a game in any other language.  I think one of the greatest problems is that it is often times the people who do not have the patience required to make a really good game that gravitate to Game Maker.  Even though many game maker user will never be able to make a good game, that is not necessarily a fault of game maker, but rather simply the fact that Game Maker has spent so many years marketing to the new and inexperienced game developers...  Not that that is a bad thing...  That was the original intent of Game Maker anyway wasn't it?  Anyway...  I am rambling now...  Point being.  If you have the motivation to make a good game, then I am all for it.  I would be happy to buy your game (given it is the type of game I like to play) if it looks good, is not glitchy, and is fun.

Perhaps I am bias though because I am also in the process of trying to make a game with intent to sell...  with Game Maker.  It is an uphill battle, but I am sure it is possible!

edit:  For instance...  Project AM2R, which I am sure many of you have heard about, is a pretty dang good game made with Game Maker.  Granted it will never make a buck for copyright reasons, but it goes to show that with a good developer...  You can make a good game.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2012, 12:45:15 am by Aero88 »
Logged

Jeod

Team Dekunutz, Doubleteam
Re: Selling Game Maker games on Steam... wait, W...
« Reply #26 on: February 22, 2012, 12:43:19 am »
  • *
  • Reputation: +3/-0
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Posts: 1675
I think I should stress though that Infini does make a good point. If you're trying to get into programming as a career, you should really move up from game maker.
Logged
"You should challenge your fates. When all else fails, you can still die fighting." ~Yune
___________________________________

Zelda GBC+ Engine for Multimedia Fusion 2
  • Doubleteam Project Page
Re: Selling Game Maker games on Steam... wait, W...
« Reply #27 on: February 22, 2012, 12:49:02 am »
  • ...---^^^---...
  • *
  • Reputation: +6/-0
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Posts: 616
I think I should stress though that Infini does make a good point. If you're trying to get into programming as a career, you should really move up from game maker.

Yeah I can agree with that too...  If the industry doesn't except Game Maker as a legitimate programming language than thats that.  One would definitely have a better chance of getting a career in the industry if you use the tools they are used to using.  Plane and simple.

That and as others have mentioned.  Game maker does teach bad programming habits.  Because it allows you to make so many programming mistakes and still work, many people just don't take the time to train themselves to do it right.  I was fortunate to have taken a basic C++ course before ever using Game Maker so I had a feel for what code should look like.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2012, 12:51:47 am by Aero88 »
Logged
Re: Selling Game Maker games on Steam... wait, W...
« Reply #28 on: February 22, 2012, 01:50:58 am »
  • AKA "Micah DS"
  • *
  • Reputation: +9/-0
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Posts: 1347
I think I should stress though that Infini does make a good point. If you're trying to get into programming as a career, you should really move up from game maker.

Yeah I can agree with that too...  If the industry doesn't except Game Maker as a legitimate programming language than thats that.  One would definitely have a better chance of getting a career in the industry if you use the tools they are used to using.  Plane and simple.

Yes, I have to agree with Infini and the both of you. But I'm not looking for a job to work on software or games, I would just be looking to sell a game that is already completed. And I see GM as a tool that can give me what I need to accomplish that. Especially after reading this:

GameMaker 9

...

We have a lot of other things happening with GameMaker in the next few weeks and months.  These are all designed to EXTEND the appeal of GameMaker to more of the “Indie” developers.  The Indie sector is the most exciting and fastest growing area for games and we want to make GameMaker a tool that can be seriously considered by professional and semi-professional developers.  In doing this WE ARE NOT DESERTING OUR ROOTS, in fact quite the opposite.  By extending the reach and capabilities of GameMaker we’re saying that you can start with a free and powerful game development tool, and if you’re good, you can then pursue the opportunity to publish your games on Itunes, Android Market, Ovi Store, Playstation Network, Steam, Web Portals, etc.  We think this is EXCITING for the community!  We use GameMaker for all of our games and so far we’ve had a No1 free download on iPad (Simply Solitaire HD), Top 30 Metacritic ratings (Mr Karoshi) and a Top 5 game on Android Market, “They Need to Be Fed”.  Living proof that GameMaker can be used to create successful, professional games.
 
With the launch of GameMaker: Studio later this year you’ll be able to publish your own games on iTunes and Android Market.  Studio will also make it easier for you to work with other people on your game. We’ll also include better tech to allow you to publish Windows and Mac versions of your games in places like Steam and Apple’s Mac App Store.
 
With GameMaker:HTML5, which will ship later this month you will be able to  target the huge opportunity for HTML5 games. 
 
We’ll continue to publish some of your games too and share the revenues with you.  We’re working on making it easier for you to contact us for publishing opportunities, but I’ll write about that in the next couple of weeks ina separate post.
 
In summary, GameMaker is the centre of everything we do at YoYo.  We’re not deserting our basic principles that GameMaker should start as a free program and we’re not intending to keep increasing the price of GameMaker:Standard.  We’re trying to extend the appeal of GameMaker to professional developers with GameMaker: HTML5 and GameMaker:Studio editions which will both be out in 2011.  In 2012 EVERY version of GameMaker will get a complete rewrite (and many new features.
 
Sandy
Btw, sort of off-topic: I broke their "They Need to Be Fed" game when I played it. Was running to the right and jumped and fell under a counter-clockwise rotating platform, then the character started drifting down-left at a 22.5ish degree angle while gaining momentum, and he zipped down off the bottom of the screen... he never came back. Poor guy, what a way to go.

Anyway, even though I'm not super impressed by their boasts at the end of that first paragraph, this information still shows that they are aiming to support indie developers, and even professional developers (but I'm going to take that as meaning "semi-professional").

Sure, I'm not going to get a job working for a video game company, but I don't aim to. If I did want that, then yes, I'd definitely need to move beyond GM. There's no way I'd get a job otherwise. Heck, it'd be doubtful that I could even get a job at YoYo Games! All I'm saying is that GM is proving to be a useful tool for an indie game developer like me. And it's definitely possible to get a GM game on to Steam.
Logged
  • My Music
Re: Selling Game Maker games on Steam... wait, W...
« Reply #29 on: February 22, 2012, 04:31:54 am »
  • *
  • Reputation: +9/-1
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Posts: 4654
Would people really pay for crap made in game maker?

Hell i was surprised when that RPGMaker looking game call of chthululululu sold on steam.

I wouldn't pay for "crap", but I would pay for an enjoyable and well-made game, even if it was made with Game Maker.

To be honest, I've never seen a Game Maker game that I'd pay for. But, to be fair, most Game Maker games are made by people that aren't trying to sell. Money motivates. Therefore, it doesn't exactly seem logical to judge Game Maker on fan-made games, or even any freeware Game Maker game. In some cases, I've seen people trying to sell GM games on their own websites, and even those sucked, but it was obviously not Game Maker's fault, it was the developer's fault. The problems were in the graphics, the story, the mechanics, etc. It's clear that they didn't know enough about using Game Maker properly and efficiently.
And it's not just Game Maker games that can suck. I've seen my fair share of other crappy games that were programmed in a "real" programming language.


You played gauntlet seven sorrows and 4 heroes of light too i see.
Logged


Mamoruanime

@Mamoruanime
Re: Selling Game Maker games on Steam... wait, W...
« Reply #30 on: February 22, 2012, 05:04:36 am »
  • ^Not actually me.
  • *
  • Reputation: +9/-0
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Posts: 9786
I'm reasonably positive nobody's dogged GM because of the slew of low quality games... That's not the reason professional grade programmers dislike GM at all.
Logged
Re: Selling Game Maker games on Steam... wait, W...
« Reply #31 on: February 22, 2012, 05:59:23 am »
  • *
  • Reputation: +9/-1
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Posts: 4654
I'm reasonably positive nobody's dogged GM because of the slew of low quality games... That's not the reason professional grade programmers dislike GM at all.

Actually thats why i made fun of it.
Logged


Mamoruanime

@Mamoruanime
Re: Selling Game Maker games on Steam... wait, W...
« Reply #32 on: February 22, 2012, 06:13:02 pm »
  • ^Not actually me.
  • *
  • Reputation: +9/-0
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Posts: 9786
>:( Fish, stop implying you're a person >:(

(<3)
Logged
Pages: 1 [2]   Go Up

 


Contact Us | Legal | Advertise Here
2013 © ZFGC, All Rights Reserved



Page created in 0.159 seconds with 79 queries.

anything