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Author Topic: Story Pass :: SECOND ACT  (Read 8346 times)

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Re: Story Pass :: SECOND ACT
« Reply #80 on: February 09, 2013, 06:25:27 pm »
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We should have the 4 spirits you save gather at the obstacle and play a Saria's Song quartet to get rid of the branches
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Re: Story Pass :: SECOND ACT
« Reply #81 on: February 09, 2013, 09:06:17 pm »
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Hero encounter definitely should happen first, otherwise there's no reason for the player to remove the barrier.
I don't that is right. As you said yourself. We have kept the player already rather busy with the tutorial and 5 deku missions and later the the deku palace part. If the player first has to navigate Kokiri Forest and then still has to deal with 4 Kokiri Spirit jobs, it will take even more time. So I was more thinking of having 2 or 3 spirits before the Hero encounter and then 2 or 3 after.

Not to mention we can also have some mandatory Spirit encounters after the dungeon where Link has to get out of Kokiri Forest.

1. Return the Kokori sword (we could have the spirit allude to the fact that somebody took it out to fend of Ganon, inspired by the Hero of Time. Obviously just a vague allusion, though.)

2. I was thinking have a spirit want the rocks of grass cleared out from in front of Mido's house, just like how the Kokori in OoT was tasked. Like they never got all the rocks cleared so they're anal about it in death.

3. Maybe include a reference to how OoT Link needed a shield to get in to see the Deku Tree also? Like, KoT Link would need to find a shield in the rubble of the shop or something?

4. There's also the simple, defeat all these enemies that are inhabiting my old house. You don't want Deku Baba slobbering all over where your bed used to be before your village was destroyed.
I'm sorry but I am not really liking this idea for two reasons. The first is that it is to big a fanboy reference to OOT. It kinda says "Hey I am making a fangame and I put situations from OOT in my game with some slight adaptations." If you want to make a reference to OOT do it subtle. As including Kokiri and a dead Deku Tree already is. However this just screams uninspired fangame to me. I'm sorry. The second reason is that we had the same setup in the Deku Village already. We have a barrier we can't get through, but there are several NPC's with jobs in the neighborhood that will make the barrier go away if I go look for them. I think it is a bit to soon for such a repetition in the narative. I think the spirit encounters should flow more naturally as you should chase or somehow capture them.


When I designed Tilo, I had her in mind only for the temple itself.  Definitely not scrapping her, I just didn't consider her for this area.
Well, I kinda remember something that she was looking for some treasure she lost in the dungeon once. However I took a look at the wiki and it is not up there. Apparantly that got scrapped. I guess she is just a gameplay mechanic for the dungeon now.

However if you still consider making her part of the narative, which I think is great, then I think a small encounter would be necessary before Link enters the dungeon. First it would show the player that Tilo is a Kokiri Spirit from the Forest and not a part of the furniture of the dungeon. Second you would need less dialog/text explaining here precense. Before she enters the dungeon you could have here exclaim "That witch! She can't have my treasure." and in the vault she would say "My doll!" (or whatever else is her treasure). For the rest the interaction doesn't really need more dialog. Just her animation and thus actions would tell her story. This would be a classic case of "Show. Don't tell."
« Last Edit: February 09, 2013, 09:09:02 pm by Zaeranos »
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Re: Story Pass :: SECOND ACT
« Reply #82 on: February 12, 2013, 04:04:28 pm »
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I disagree about a couple points, but you bring up some pretty good things.

The Kokori village is too long, and yeah, DEFINITELY is just a big repeat of the structure of the Deku village. However, we can convey a lot of the world's lore in this area, and it would be a shame to miss out on that.

What I'm thinking now is that we should make most of the quests here optional. If you walk into the area, most people will recognize it as a ruined, overgrown Kokori village, because we've all played OoT. That will be enough to get the point across of hey, the Kokori were here but died off.

But it'd be really cool to still have more detail, like, during his quest for the triforce before, Ganon uprooted the Deku tree. Then monsters started moving in on the area, and the Kokori died off, etc.

The main points for the current-day plot of KoT, however, are given through the interaction between the Hero's Shade and Maple. So why don't we have it so when Link walks into the area, he sees them, and then can proceed directly into the temple after Maple. If the player wants to, they can check the village ruins out and find some journal pages giving details, solve a puzzle to find the Kokori sword which might be a trading quest item, etc.
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Re: Story Pass :: SECOND ACT
« Reply #83 on: February 12, 2013, 04:16:03 pm »
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That could work actually, we could have the player follow Maple's tracks into the temple.
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Re: Story Pass :: SECOND ACT
« Reply #84 on: February 12, 2013, 07:03:54 pm »
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May I point out that we don't have to put all the lore in the story before the dungeon. In most Zelda games Link is put back at the entrance. If you make the map be that Link cannot go the same way back as he came when leaving Kokiri Forest, you could add some of the Kokiri story after the dungeon.
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Re: Story Pass :: SECOND ACT
« Reply #85 on: February 12, 2013, 09:37:11 pm »
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Eeehh, we could do that, I suppose. But dungeons are always an area resolution. It's kinda unfulfilling to say okay, you're in a random area that has a dungeon. Go through this dungeon, beat the boss. Okay, NOW you can learn that the area you're in has a story to it. Now that you have a story and possible connection to the area... buh bye!

Lots of times story stuff happens after Link completes a dungeon, but it's usually "oh! Now this area's problems are solved!", and there's a really good reason that it's that way. I'm sticking to my opinion that Link can walk through the Kokori village and explore as much or as little as the player wants. That way, the overall plot still flows really nicely:
Deku have problems!
Link helps them with smaller ones
Witnesses them addressing their big problem
Goes to the temple and connects this area with the game's conflict (through Maple/the Hero)
Resolves multiple things on beating the temple (Maple doesn't get this cog, the spores stop spreading)

Then on his way back through the Deku village, Link will see that his work in the dungeon helped stop the spores that were affecting the Deku, etc.
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Re: Story Pass :: SECOND ACT
« Reply #86 on: February 18, 2013, 04:11:18 pm »
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Alright, lemme make a summary of what we have so far:

1. Link enters the forest and navigates it to the Kokiri Village.
2. Link will find the Hero conversing with Maple and after eavesdropping will learn that Maple is going to the temple.  The two then head about their business.
3(?). Link tracks down Maple, maybe by following a trail of a leaked potion she was carrying?
4. Link is lead to the Deku Tree remains, which he uses as the path into the temple
5. <insert temple mumbo jumbo here>
6. Swamp issue is resolved?
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Re: Story Pass :: SECOND ACT
« Reply #87 on: February 19, 2013, 01:42:04 am »
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Yup, sounds good!

I dunno if it'll even be necessary to provide the player clues as to where Maple went, it might just be good enough to see her head north or wherever and go that general direction, and the player is bound to find the area. We don't want to take away too much exploring.

Also, I know we're gonna have Maple oppose Link more directly later, like fight him somehow, but do we want anything like that in the forest/swamp area? So that Link fights Maple somehow in all four areas? I could even be something as simple as, she allows seem swamp monsters to get into the area where they are and she leaves.
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Re: Story Pass :: SECOND ACT
« Reply #88 on: February 19, 2013, 04:38:05 am »
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Maybe he can fight her after the temple?  Kinda like, "oh screw you, you beat me to the cog so ima kick your ass!"
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Re: Story Pass :: SECOND ACT
« Reply #89 on: February 19, 2013, 03:14:32 pm »
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Yeah, that's one possibility.

The others I can think of are 1) not fighting her until the Goron area
2) fighting her somewhere in the Deku village or swamp.

Dunno what I think is best.



Anyway, shall we move onto the Zora?
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Re: Story Pass :: SECOND ACT
« Reply #90 on: February 19, 2013, 03:27:07 pm »
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Yes, I'd say we have enough covered here to move on.  I'll sticky this and prepare it for the wiki tonight.  If there are further comments, please feel free to leave them here!
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