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General => Entertainment => Topic started by: Moon_child on February 10, 2009, 12:56:08 am

Title: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Moon_child on February 10, 2009, 12:56:08 am: (http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b311/Hyrule_boy/comparison.png)
Would you rather play the sprite based Arkanoid, because it looks so much better. Then the ugly and simple looking ASCII Arkanoid?
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: शेफाली on February 10, 2009, 01:01:04 am: In this particular case, the ASCII version looks better.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: 4Sword on February 10, 2009, 01:05:16 am: You are trying to make a point in limited scope. A game with less developed graphics is not necessarily ugly. Because it looks as if it was made as part of an assignment for school, the simple act of getting that far in terms of game programming would be an accomplishment to the person who made it. I would rather play something I programmed than something that just looks good.

It could go either way for me because I do not diminish something simply based on how it looks.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: NickAVV on February 10, 2009, 01:10:33 am: I like how your poll options force you to pin yourself as a !@#$% if graphics do matter to you.

Didn't vote, and yes graphics matter to me in a modern game. I don't want to see aliased edges and individual polygons on a current-gen console. Those are all good and well for N64 games, but in this day and age we can manage more than that, and frankly it looks like !@#$% on my HDTV.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Infinitus on February 10, 2009, 01:10:48 am: You need to judge a game based on the sum of its component parts, thinking only about one specific element is a terrible way of deciding if a game is good or not, or if you want to play it or not.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Moldrill on February 10, 2009, 01:12:23 am: Those are possibly the worst two answers, so I'm not going to answer. I don't mind games that look horrible, unless the graphics affect the gameplay negatively.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Lindgren on February 10, 2009, 01:28:51 am: Graphics do matter to me, but I'm not a "graphics !@#$%".

Now just because the graphics have to be good does not mean they have to be super photo realistic or use amazing technology. Some of what I consider to be the greatest looking games are for the SNES, because they are very stylized and look amazing.
As for your "I chose a Wii" option. I would say that even though the Wii does not have great technology, there are some very good looking games for it. There are also a lot of !@#$% games that are not appealing to the eyes in any forms and have nothing going for them graphically.

Also Infin is right. The individual components that make up the game are a lot less important than the sum of those components.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Mitsu on February 10, 2009, 01:50:41 am: Graphics don't really matter me, but if I have a choice between two versions of the same game and one has better graphics, I'll go with that one.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: sjegtp on February 10, 2009, 01:57:44 am: Not so much.

IMO, you don't need to have astounding graphics to make the game fun.

However, graphics do matter when they affect the gameplay. For instance, in this arkanoid game, the Ascii version makes it more difficult to see the blocks well and the "ball" (or whatever that is) position, so you may have difficulty to play it. Also, in the sprited version, the "ball" probably moves smoothlier (ex.: in a 2pixels/step speed in stead of a 1character/second speed), which can be better to see, but can result in some bugs like getting stuck at the block - a bug that won't happen in the Ascii version as frequently.

Also, graphics, as well as the sounds and music, often manipulate the players, specially on RPGs. It can seduce the player in such a way that could make a rather simple game with clichÃ© story be called "epic".
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: xero on February 10, 2009, 03:10:00 am: Graphics are a huge factor in how well a game was developed, in my honest opinion. But with that, I must state that both of the screen shots posted are beautiful in their own way. Each demonstrates a unique style, where every pixel (or in the case of the first game, ASCII character) fits well together.

My biggest problem with game graphics are when developers throw a bunch of random graphics together for their game that look horrible together. For example, a Game-Boy style Link would look horrible with Minish Cap tiles and Link to the Past NPC's.

Games are artwork too. Personally, I wouldn't mind outdated graphics (2d or 3d) as long as they fit a specific style.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Colbydude on February 10, 2009, 03:14:00 am: Meh, I'm not so much about graphics as I am gameplay. But if it can look good and have great performance and playability I'm all for it. And what about the choice where you have "I'm not too much about graphics and didn't buy a Wii."
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Dumb_Ass on February 10, 2009, 03:20:01 am: If I can have good graphics and still have great gameplay, then why not? I'm not just going to buy a Wii to show that I'm a rebel.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: InvaderLupus on February 10, 2009, 03:33:06 am: Wow, way to put a "I'm close-minded!" sign on your head, Hyrule Boy.

A similar argument would be "You either love George Bush are you're an anti-american terrorist"
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Downsider on February 10, 2009, 03:35:13 am: I hate people who think they're cool when they say graphics don't matter.

They do, you dumbass.

Graphics certainly complement gameplay, and honestly change the feel of the game. Even an M4 with a reskin that makes it look like an M16 still makes it feel like a whole different gun.
(http://www.zfgc.com/forum/Themes/midnight/images/warnwarn.gif) Don't directly insult people - in fact you shouldn't be insulting them at all. Consider this a warning.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Kren on February 10, 2009, 03:39:02 am: IMO bad graphics aren't bad, but if you say that NES games sucks because of the graphics then thats dumb, they had limitations that they needed to follow. hmm Now a Days I just go for style, if ASCII looks better then sure I will prefer it, atleast in this case.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: FictitiousSpoon on February 10, 2009, 03:58:49 am: Graphics matter to me for the first five minutes or if they obstruct a goal or something, honestly in the first five minutes I play, if the graphics are a drastic improvement over what I'm already playing then I go, "Gee, these graphics are really nice" After that five minutes is up I don't really pay attention to the graphics unless they are really horrible.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Nabeshin on February 10, 2009, 04:17:30 am: I voted No.

In defense of HB's poll choices, he's not being serious - they're both just exaggerations of the negative responses that often arise for each.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: FISSURE on February 10, 2009, 04:20:23 am: Quote from: Downsider on February 10, 2009, 03:35:13 am
I hate people who think they're cool when they say graphics don't matter.

They do, you dumbass.

Graphics certainly complement gameplay, and honestly change the feel of the game. Even an M4 with a reskin that makes it look like an M16 still makes it feel like a whole different gun.

No they don't

shut up u face.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Packie on February 10, 2009, 04:53:33 am: I used to think graphics werent important. Then I got my new !@#$% computer!!! And graphics make a game a million times better!
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Dantztron 3030 on February 10, 2009, 05:13:50 am: I stand by my age-old argument: good graphics don't make a bad game good, but they can make a good game a hell of a lot better.

The reason? Immersion. Games are best when they completely suck you into their universe, and having lots of pretty things to look at, coupled with addicting gameplay and a well-written story, can draw you in even more than the best book.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Wasabi on February 10, 2009, 06:38:07 am: Quote from: Downsider on February 10, 2009, 03:35:13 am
I hate people who think they're cool when they say graphics don't matter.

They do, you dumbass.

Graphics certainly complement gameplay, and honestly change the feel of the game. Even an M4 with a reskin that makes it look like an M16 still makes it feel like a whole different gun.
It wouldn't for me, I can't tell the difference.
And so called "good" graphics are a matter of opinion. "Good" graphics to me are ones that compliment each other, and are all in the same style. If anything looks slightly different it throws the illusion and I'm brought back to earth realizing I'm staring at a bunch of pixels.
Of course, good graphics aren't the only thing that makes a game. Everything needs to be well thought out or at least have some consistency.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: AoDC on February 10, 2009, 01:03:22 pm: Quote from: Dantztron 3030 on February 10, 2009, 05:13:50 am
Immersion.
This is exactly why I am a graphic !@#$%.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Easy_D on February 10, 2009, 03:05:38 pm: You're stupid, just because you own a Wii doesn't mean you should accept shitty PSP ports on the system.

As a gamer I'd like to immerse myself in the game world and bad graphics certainly don't help in the enjoyment of gaming.

A game with bad graphics is like reading a book with little to no enviromnent description.
You need the world to come alive in a believable way and bad graphics completely destroys that aspect.

Please stop posting topics.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: SlimmyG on February 10, 2009, 03:32:57 pm: Quote from: Downsider on February 10, 2009, 03:35:13 am
I hate people who think they're cool when they say graphics don't matter.

They do, you dumbass.

Thats your opinion. Personally I think you can have an amazing without good graphics, although of course great graphics are preferable.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Easy_D on February 10, 2009, 03:46:17 pm: People also need to learn the !@#$% difference between good graphics and good art.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Mamoruanime on February 10, 2009, 10:58:22 pm: They go hand in hand; it's not one or the other.

The issue that's being poked at with this thread is "People hate the wii because of the graphics".

No; that's not the case. People hate the wii because of the shitty 3rd and 1st party games, and ports of games on other consoles that have better graphics. Honestly, why would someone want to play a downgraded version of a game on a more powerful system?

If the Wii gets better first party games; not waggle games, then maybe it'll be a buy. The problem is; where are those good first party games?
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Racoon Boy on February 10, 2009, 11:43:55 pm: Quote from: Mamoruanime on February 10, 2009, 10:58:22 pm
where are those good first party games?

I think it has enough good first party games to justify it's purchase. Then again, I'm used to owning around 5 games per generation, so I may be able to settle for less than others.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Tet on February 10, 2009, 11:48:08 pm: Quote
I hate people who think they're cool when they say graphics don't matter.

They do, you dumbass.

Quote
u dun agree wif me
ur dumb

As for me, it more or less doesn't matter. I'll play a game with bad graphics as long as it still looks dignified.

Quote from: Mamoruanime
where are those good first party games?
Opinions opinions. The software library is better than its rep.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Mamoruanime on February 10, 2009, 11:51:17 pm: Quote from: Racoon Boy on February 10, 2009, 11:43:55 pm
Quote from: Mamoruanime on February 10, 2009, 10:58:22 pm
where are those good first party games?

I think it has enough good first party games to justify it's purchase. Then again, I'm used to owning around 5 games per generation, so I may be able to settle for less than others.

Yeah no doubt it's justified for people who enjoy games like Mario Galaxy and such. I personally got sick of the Mario scene after Mario 64 DS. Mario Galaxy is a pretty game though.

I think Warioland is a good game, amongst a few others, but I just don't have enough interest in the other games released to want to buy the system :P
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: a Hint of Lime on February 11, 2009, 01:36:41 am: Yes graphics matter to me. I still love loads of games with awful graphics, but when I buy a current game, I want it to look good. Games are a visual media, so they should look good visually.

This doesn't mean realistic: I love stylized graphics. However, low resolution outputs (wii) bother me, because it isn't up to date.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: FISSURE on February 11, 2009, 01:41:46 am: Quote from: a Hint of Lime on February 11, 2009, 01:36:41 am
Yes graphics matter to me. I still love loads of games with awful graphics, but when I buy a current game, I want it to look good. Games are a visual media, so they should look good visually.

This doesn't mean realistic: I love stylized graphics. However, low resolution outputs (wii) bother me, because it isn't up to date.

XD low resolution output.

People concentrate too much on !@#$% like HD quality and what not.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: InvaderLupus on February 11, 2009, 01:56:17 am: Quote from: FISSURE on February 11, 2009, 01:41:46 am
Quote from: a Hint of Lime on February 11, 2009, 01:36:41 am
Yes graphics matter to me. I still love loads of games with awful graphics, but when I buy a current game, I want it to look good. Games are a visual media, so they should look good visually.

This doesn't mean realistic: I love stylized graphics. However, low resolution outputs (wii) bother me, because it isn't up to date.

XD low resolution output.

People concentrate too much on !@#$% like HD quality and what not.

HD quality makes huge difference with large HD tvs. Non-HD gams and programming can oftentimes look like !@#$% on a 46" LCD tv.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: FISSURE on February 11, 2009, 02:11:23 am: Quote from: InvaderLupus on February 11, 2009, 01:56:17 am
Quote from: FISSURE on February 11, 2009, 01:41:46 am
Quote from: a Hint of Lime on February 11, 2009, 01:36:41 am
Yes graphics matter to me. I still love loads of games with awful graphics, but when I buy a current game, I want it to look good. Games are a visual media, so they should look good visually.

This doesn't mean realistic: I love stylized graphics. However, low resolution outputs (wii) bother me, because it isn't up to date.

XD low resolution output.

People concentrate too much on !@#$% like HD quality and what not.

HD quality makes huge difference with large HD tvs. Non-HD gams and programming can oftentimes look like !@#$% on a 46" LCD tv.

Easy to solve this. Don't buy an HD tv.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: sjegtp on February 11, 2009, 02:23:18 am: Quote from: FISSURE on February 11, 2009, 02:11:23 am
Easy to solve this. Don't buy an HD tv.
<.< Well, that makes sense, you can just play it on a non-HD TV.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Mewgull on February 11, 2009, 02:24:18 am: (I didn't vote because of the options <_<)

Anyways, I don't consider myself as someone who likes a game for the graphics. I actually like the characters who have 3-Dimensional personalities. Graphics make the game look nice. I once played a game that had great graphics, but the gameplay was !@#$%...
I also like a game because of the morals it teaches.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: NickAVV on February 11, 2009, 02:24:33 am: Quote from: FISSURE on February 11, 2009, 02:11:23 am
Quote from: InvaderLupus on February 11, 2009, 01:56:17 am
Quote from: FISSURE on February 11, 2009, 01:41:46 am
Quote from: a Hint of Lime on February 11, 2009, 01:36:41 am
Yes graphics matter to me. I still love loads of games with awful graphics, but when I buy a current game, I want it to look good. Games are a visual media, so they should look good visually.

This doesn't mean realistic: I love stylized graphics. However, low resolution outputs (wii) bother me, because it isn't up to date.

XD low resolution output.

People concentrate too much on !@#$% like HD quality and what not.

HD quality makes huge difference with large HD tvs. Non-HD gams and programming can oftentimes look like !@#$% on a 46" LCD tv.

Easy to solve this. Don't buy an HD tv.
That's horrible advice.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: FISSURE on February 11, 2009, 02:25:50 am: Quote from: Moldorma on February 11, 2009, 02:24:33 am
Quote from: FISSURE on February 11, 2009, 02:11:23 am
Quote from: InvaderLupus on February 11, 2009, 01:56:17 am
Quote from: FISSURE on February 11, 2009, 01:41:46 am
Quote from: a Hint of Lime on February 11, 2009, 01:36:41 am
Yes graphics matter to me. I still love loads of games with awful graphics, but when I buy a current game, I want it to look good. Games are a visual media, so they should look good visually.

This doesn't mean realistic: I love stylized graphics. However, low resolution outputs (wii) bother me, because it isn't up to date.

XD low resolution output.

People concentrate too much on !@#$% like HD quality and what not.

HD quality makes huge difference with large HD tvs. Non-HD gams and programming can oftentimes look like !@#$% on a 46" LCD tv.

Easy to solve this. Don't buy an HD tv.
That's horrible advice.

No it isn't
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Hoffy on February 11, 2009, 05:33:46 am: I like pretty games.

But I can still enjoy ones that don't look quite as good, and ones that don't use the best technology. Like old games, but some new ones. Just has to have good art style. Or even then, sometimes not.

... Graphics are confusing :-X.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Tyler on February 11, 2009, 04:24:48 pm: visuals encompass two elements: tech (graphics) and art

some games might have good tech, but poor art. sometimes the tech is so good you dont care that the art is generic or simply absent (like Crysis)

some games might have good art, but poor tech. sometimes the art is so cool that you dont care the tech is lackluster (like No more heroes)

some people like tech better and cant stand stuff like jaggies or no realtime shadows and !@#$%
some people like art better and cant stand unoriginal games that all look the same

I'd like to call that first category of gamers GREAT WHITE SHARKS. Their body, their teeth, their speed... a marvel of aquatic evolution.
I'd like to call that second category of gamers MOTHERFUCKING NARWHALS. They might look ugly or weird, but goddamn if that motherfucking horn doesnt just impale every !@#$% seal in sight, goddamn.

I'm personally more of a NARWHAL GODDAMN, but even I can drool at tech specs like a GREAT WHITE SHARK.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Hedanito on February 11, 2009, 04:44:04 pm: Quote
Would you rather play the sprite based Arkanoid, because it looks so much better. Then the ugly and simple looking ASCII Arkanoid?
Of course i would rather play the nice looking arkanoid. They are both exactly the same games, the only difference is the graphics, so i would obviously choose the better looking one.

When you compare games that are different from each other gameplay is the most important thing. Its nice if a game looks good, but if its really boring you would just stop playing. When a game looks bad it can still be a lot of fun to play. Like OOT. The graphics are really bad compared to what games look like these days, but i still enjoy it every time i play it.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Garoth Moulinoski on February 11, 2009, 07:28:19 pm: Graphics matter but don't matter as much as gameplay or ease-of-use. Bad graphics can mean different things to different people.

What I consider bad graphics are blending graphics. Like your avatar sprite blending in with the background or an enemy sprite blending in with the background (although sometimes, this is intentional, like for a dark room. Even then, your avatar is usually lit anyway). Too many bright colors put together or too many dark colors put together. The graphics portion needs to take into account the concepts of art into it (like you couldn't tell that) so one needs to take into account such things like contrast.

Still, underdeveloped graphics can not be a bad thing. Simple sprites contrasting with the background with good controls and good level design can make it a masterpiece. The same game done with blending graphics can destroy it.

Graphics matter but it isn't the only thing that makes a game good. Good graphics (i.e. I know where my avatar is, I know where my enemies are, I know where there's a pitfall, etc.) coupled with bad controls or level design can be just as disastrous. Even bad programming, such as bad collision detection, can break a game even it has awesome graphics.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: A Storm in the Desert on February 12, 2009, 06:59:42 am: I think that gratuitously good graphics are fine, as long as the rest of the game/gameplay mechanics don't suffer due to the developers spending no time on anything but the GFX.
Title: Re: Do better graphics really matter to you?
Post by: Tet on February 12, 2009, 10:57:51 pm: Quote
I'd like to call that first category of gamers GREAT WHITE SHARKS. Their body, their teeth, their speed... a marvel of aquatic evolution.
I'd like to call that second category of gamers MOTHERFUCKING NARWHALS. They might look ugly or weird, but goddamn if that motherfucking horn doesnt just impale every !@#$% seal in sight, goddamn.
What about the manatees?