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[thestig]

thestig

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

I have a proposal regarding the progression idea... you guys are thinking it in terms of a monorail when actually, you could go the non-traditional Zelda route and introduce more than one item between each dungeon or during each dungeon(s).. either that, or the amount of items you has will have to be dropped off if you're going to be doing a single step progression.

In response to the spinning top spawning tornado's idea, I feel the sprite from Minish Cap is propositional enough to do the job right. As for the usage, it should be based on magic... this wouldn't be the first time such a move were introduced in a Zelda game. Refer to Four Swords Adventures when you hold B long enough in the triangular stance... the four Links spin around the map in a very "torando-esque" fashion. Or better yet, Twilight Princess in itself had a tornado-esque move with the boomerang. That's something to think about. The tornado from the spin top could "boost" Link up allowing him to jump over cliffs, for example. I don't think the tornado's that are spawned from the spin-top should necessarily be moving around, but rather, stationary.

Thoughts?
 
EDIT: Sorry, hit enter!! That's why my post came in incomplete >_<..

EDIT #2: Also, before the items are worked out, I think the process in developing items should be done in a more organized fashion. You guys already had the idea, but maybe you should focus in on how the items would work with the game first before knowing what the items are. It doesn't make sense, I know. What I'm trying to say is, it's probably a good idea to know how the item progression will take place... you already knew that items would be essential keys to puzzles, so that's already half of that part done.

Maybe it's alright to talk about items here and there, though. It just felt important to note that since this topic was somewhat hard to follow starting off, but with time and patience it can be done.

[MG-Zero]

MG-Zero

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

I do agree it's important to make the items work with the game first.  I also think your description of the spinner is a good start towards that.  It defines how the item functions.  What's left now is to discuss limitations on the item as well as types of puzzles it can be used on.  If we do this recursively for each major quest item, we'll know all of the puzzle types in the game and then they can be implemented into dungeons and sidequests.

i love big weenies and i cannot lie

[The gold chuchu]

The gold chuchu

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

 

Spinner >> Can make tornadoes appear and lift heavy things(like statues and such) , can be used as a "key" in certain places.

Magic Rod >> Uses the elements to perform different acts such as burn, wet, grow, and send.

Slingshot >> Can stun enemies and hit targets from afar.

That's all I have so far, just a basic description of what each item dose.

[MG-Zero]

MG-Zero

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

Good good, that's a good start.  I do have to say though, they should be more specific (for example, what direction do the tornados from the spinner go, what are its limitations etc?).

i love big weenies and i cannot lie

[Max.]

Max.

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

So I'm not entirely where to pose this question, but, did this game die? It seemed like a fairly abrupt stop if so. I'm a little disappointed, because this coulda been pretty cool. Did any groups need help and not get it and now we're dead? I'm just asking this because I would like to help, if necessary...

[MG-Zero]

MG-Zero

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

I have absolutely no idea what happened.  I check this everyday to see if there are any posts, I can't think of a way to kick start it.

i love big weenies and i cannot lie

[Max.]

Max.

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

Perhaps if you, presuming you have this power 'cause you seem to be the leader, one of those whether you want to or not because everybody is looking at you, perhaps if you make some executive decisions? Like say, okay, we've got five dungeons. We're gonna have the slingshot in the first one, fire rod in the second, hookshot in the third, and spinner in the fourth, you need whatever items to get into whatever dungeons, and then set up a system for people to make appeals if they dislike your decisions?

That's just one idea, anyway.

Also, there is no official, that I could find, King of Thieves to-do list. Personally, I work from to do lists, and this would help a lot, I think, because for ages in these forums, it's been people making suggestions and them being ignored and undecided because some other group has to make some decision first, but nobody is posting in their topic. For example, if the overworld guys need to decide where the dungeons are before the item guys can pick the items before the dungeon guys can start designing, then there should be a to do list in that order. Big red check marks are also very encouraging. I'd love to help, because I've become pretty good at to-do ing recently, as long as I have somebody who actually knows what's going on when I'm like, this needs done! Who does it?

The only thing is that this system isn't as conducive to the way the KoT forums are set up now. It'd be more streamlined if there was ONE forum, with maybe an appeals subforum. The topic at the top of the to do list is first, then once that's done, the topic is locked. Appeals could be made if somebody has another idea or something in the appeals subforum.

Still, I'm just brainstorming, though. I would really love to see the community game back on its feet, though, because since I joined I really like this community, even though I'm still pretty new.

Also... Perhaps everybody is just busy making their own games?

Also, and more off topic, this was my 100th post, and was posted right about the exact same time I turned nineteen. So commerative!

[Eleo]

Eleo

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

Just a tiny little nod to the subject, some to-do lists would work nicely, and even if it is a community project things would probably be easier with a leader who decides which suggestions are good and which won't work. Otherwise we all sit around after making contradicting suggestions, being all "yah, I think this, but you think that... so....."

I sort dropped out this summer, cause my dad got very sick (had a stroke), so all my extra energy just disappeared. However, with some clearer to-do structure on the project I wouldn't mind contributing sporadically now during the winter, stuff has stabilized and my energy is slowly coming back. Zelda fangames for the win, you know. Booh yah!

- Viewing at the moment: Project Runway [TV-series].
- Reading at the moment: Kuragehime [manga], Uncanny X-men issues 37 - 66 [comics].
- Listening to at the moment:
- Playing at the moment: Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles [GCN], FFCC: Ring of Fates [NDS].
- Let's Play in-the-making at the moment: Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles [GCN]
- Studying at the moment: University course "French, Preparatory Course" for a re-examination on subcourse "Grammar and Translation" in August, University course "Basic Course in the Humanities" for a re-examination on subcourse "The Concept of Culture" in August.

[MG-Zero]

MG-Zero

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

Eleo - nbd, !@#$% happens

Donotfeed - If you read through the threads and glance and some of the older thread titles, there was a "to do list" so to speak, although we simply just put in plain sight what was the next step.  For some reason or another however, people ignored it.  I also attempted to get on track which items will appear in which dungeons, and the functionality of so said items (items were the most recent goal).  However, again, this was ignored despite several attempts to get it back on track and most members went and did their own thing.  Seriously, what do you do at that point?  The main plan to keep things on track was to have directors for each division organize content and submit it to myself, Star and Kren based on a deadline system.  This was working at first, but then our directors stopped participating.  This is probably where the issues started coming up.  I will send out a mass PM to all project participants in another attempt to get this back on track.  That will probably happen later tonight or early tomorrow, as I'm at work right now.  The goal is to get it back where we left off, which was defining the scope of the items.  

i love big weenies and i cannot lie

[The gold chuchu]

The gold chuchu

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

Good good, that's a good start.  I do have to say though, they should be more specific (for example, what direction do the tornados from the spinner go, what are its limitations etc?).

The spinner mainly works as a key too some puzzle in ruin-like temples, like an old crypt or underground cavern(like the water temple, maybe) to "unlock" and expand the path or passageway. It works as this; the spinner enters a key like hole in the middle of the floor, which Link had to reach through his suspense, and (with you rapidly tapping the button) Link activates the spinner and the "door" or path will be revealed. It can also be used as a weapon, and, sometimes uses it's tornadoes to clear a path in over-world, among other things.

I'd like too also mention the items usefulness outside and inside dungeons as well. Like, if we are to only have 13 items, at least, we can explain why Link needs these items and such.

[Max.]

Max.

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

Hey, I just had a brainstorm for the spinner, dunno if you guys will like it or not, but since we're using cogs, what if we combine the spinner with the cogs, so the end of the dungeon items have functionality? The spinner and cogs go hand in hand in regards to shape,so they could work great in tandem.

There are some levels that we could give here, like, if you have the Kokori cog, you could use it on green or wooden or whatever switches, and open certain paths that way, once you have the Goron cog, you could open either red or metal or stone switches. This essentially makes it like the beams in metroid prime, that you would need a certain beam/cog to open certain doors, blocking progress without having advanced the plot.
Or, the cogs could give the spinner certain abilities depending on which cog you equipped. If you equip the Kokori cog, you could do a tornado, if you equip the Goron cog, you could either shoot fire or maybe interact with certain machines or stone. The Zola cog could make it rain or let you surf across water, or perhaps just a water attack.

Anyway, that was just an idea that occurred to me. I like giving end of the dungeon items functionality.


Also, as far as items, I'll actually go ahead and fill out some of those formats that MG suggested a while ago.
edit: I'll try to put these in the order I guess you'd get them/a logical order at least...


Proposed Spinner and Cogs

Spinner
Found in Hyrule Town

Press the button to board the spinner. You can zip around on it For a short period of time until your momentum runs out, allowing you to use it to make quick dashes to get away for things, but not to use it as a horse. It also works as a gear/cog to open some doors that had a particular indent in the floor, the same as twilight princess.
No requirements for use

Forest Cog
Found at the end of the Forest Dungeon

Equip it to the spinner to gain the ability to start small tornados. When equipped, hold down the spinner button to charge a tornado, and release it to release your twister. Tornados spin around the spinner, rather than going off on their own, because that doesn't really make sense...
Tornados can blow enemies away, like the gale seeds, or perhaps stuns them, but works around the radius of the spinner. Some puzzles activated by wind can be solved with these tornados, such as ones involving windmills getting started. Also, in certain places creating a tornado can spin you up to a higher level, like in TMC Wind Tribe Area.
Also, having this spinner equipped makes the spinner a little bit faster, in general.

Creating tornados uses a little magic?


Earth Cog
Found at the end of the Goron dungeon.

Equipping the Goron cog to the spinner and holding down the button charges a small earthquake. This stuns enemies in a larger radius around the spinner, and can kill some small ones. In certain situations, charging the spinning Goron cog causes some stones to rise or sink into the earth to create pathways, or sometimes causes metal to bend and create bridges.
Also, the spinner goes a little slower when this cog is equipped.

Creating earthquakes uses a little magic.


Ocean Cog
Found at the end of the water dungeon.

Equipping the Zora cog allows the spinner to charge up a water-based attack that can put out torches and fire enemies, as well as doing damage. The spinner with this cog equipped can also ride along special currents in the ocean and in rivers that flow too fast to swim. You can travel quickly and reach some inaccessible areas this way.
Also, when the water cog is equipped, the spinner can dash for a little longer before it runs out of momentum.

Shadow Cog
Obtained at the end of the sheikah dungeon.

Equipping the spinner with this cog and charging it would distort any nearby illusions and allow you to see through them, like bottom of the well type walls, or invisible platforms. Releasing a charged spin with the Cog of Truth would dispel any illusions and make the unseen visible for a short amount of time. It would also do some damage to enemies. And have a really cool animation.
The Sheikah cog either boosts your magic power while you're using it, or else makes it so when you use the spinner to dash quickly, you do a little deku nut teleport thing. The latter might not be a good idea...

Besides these functions, when each cog is equipped, you'd be able to open corresponding spinning locks. The forest cog could unlock wooden locks, the Goron one could do stone the Zora one could do... Water... Type locks. And the sheikah one would undo... Black colored locks. Those last two types of locks are sketchy, though.

Furthermore, it'd be cool if each cog ability was necessary in the final boss fight. You'd have one stage where you'd need to stun gannon with tornados, then you'd need to manipulate rocks he tries to use, then you'd have to put out flames he shoots, etc.


Also, I don't know if this counts as an item, but it's been mentioned that Link should learn thief skills from Ganon, one of them being tightrope walking. I did the same thing in my game as well, but I think this skill could be used to get into the first dungeon.
Functionality: when walking along a rope or other narrow space, you walk automatically in the direction, but must use the other directional arrows to keep your balance, like grinding in Tony Hawk. There could be a leaning meter, and if you lean too far, you fall.

Slingshot

Found in the deku forest, needed to access the forest dungeon.

Fires a deku seed when you press the button. Perhaps we could implement ember seeds and ice seeds like fire and ice arrows, especially if the bow upgrade is optional, but burning and freezing puzzles are not.

Must have deku seeds to use.

The slingshot can be used to hit enemies from afar, and is the most basic ranged weapon. It does minor damage to enemies. The projectiles can also be used to hit basic impact switches that are out of reach, eyeball switches, and when necessary, knock some hanging items down.


Bow and Arrows
Upgrade to Slingshot

Optional upgrade, found through side quest? Or else mandatory upgrade that is made necessary mainly through the increased range, or else the bow can trip switches the slingshot couldn't.

Functionality is the same as the slingshot, except it shoots arrows instead of deku seeds, and can facilitate the use of multiple types of arrows, fire, ice, etc

The main use of the bow would be making the slingshot a more powerful weapon, perhaps with more range or better aiming, and allowing fire and ice arrows to be used. Fire arrows could burn things, to light torches and open pathways blocked with wood. Ice arrows could freeze things to use as stepping stones, or freezing some things would make them breakable, for instance freezing a certain type of plant would make it so you could shatter it and get past.


Goron Drill
Found somewhere on the mountains, used to get onto the Goron mines.

The Goron drill would be a new face to the mole mitts, but function essentially the same. We could have a rapid tapping thing necessary, like how the spinner was spun in TP. This could drill through some walls that bombs couldn't do. However, bombs could take care of walls this couldn't handle. However, this seems a little redundant, maybe one or the other? The only way I can think to make this not gimmicky is if the drill came much later in the game, and could go through walls http at needed to be bombed as well as harder walls, and it could drill tunnels like the mole mitts, so you wouldn't have to lay bomb after bomb. Like how the megaton hammer kinds replaced bombs in OoT, but you still needed bombs for their timed and ranged capacity.

Bombs
Found in the goron area. Maybe found to get into the mines, instead if the drill, which seemed a little gimmicky. These could blow up any walls that needed to be destroyed, function the same as in other games.



Hookshot
Found in the forest temple, used first to traverse the forest canopy, going from tree to tree and branch to branch.

When you press the button, the shooting end extends on a chain from the grip. When the hook end hits your target, it stuns enemies and removes whatever power ups they might have, destroys some things like pots, latches and pulls in light objects, and drags link toward larger anchored objects it can attach to. The hookshot can drag you across gaps, activate switches if they're close enough and the right type, as well as be useful in combat.
A hookshot is used by one man in a port town as a tool to pull ships in to the docks, but was discontinued because it just kept pulling him into the sides of boats.




One last item that I would always like

Logbook
Found somewhere in Hyrule town
Equipment, accessible from the item screen. It keeps track of where things you've seen are. For instance, when you're playing and you're like, oh, I know I've seen one of those puzzles where you need magic beams to solve it! Uh, where was that? The logbook would have categories, such as spinner, slingshot, lightning rod or whatever, and looking in that category would display the map with the general location of puzzles you've already found, but haven't yet solves. Once you solved them, they'd have a little complete symbol.

[The gold chuchu]

The gold chuchu

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

thats perfect, donotfeedthemax.

[Max.]

Max.

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

Haha, it's just Max, but thanks. I figure that post started to get really really long...
Anyway.

I was thinking, the only real original item we've got is the spinner, which isn't quite original, so perhaps we should focus on one or two or more of those. Perhaps based on the particular races we're using. Like, since we've got steam punk Gorons, I had the idea of a drill, but... It needs work so it can work with bombs. Unless we get rid of bombs, which is kind of a bad idea.
But definitely a sheikah item would be cool. I was thinking some kind of shadow cloak, that would allow you to phase through certain walls, and perhaps phase inTO certain statues, which you could then control, kinda like the command melody slash dominion rod combined with the magic cape from ALTTP. Also, when weaking it, you would be able to walk straight through enemies, or be invisible to them. it would use up plenty of magic, of course, so you couldn't be invincible.
That isn't TOO original, though.

Edit:
Also, about the hookshot, I had the idea that maybe it'd go better in the forest dungeon, as the item in that dungeon, and could be used to traverse the canopy of the Deku forest. The first half of the forest temple could be on the ground, and the second half above that, on the branches and canopy, utilizing the hookshot to get around from tree to tree. I think that would be an AWESOME dungeon, one in the treetops, and some of the rooms could be in hollow trees and on the top canopy. But that's just me, I'm not really in the dungeon group. I would just like to see the hookshot used that way. I think I'll go update the previous post to be about that instead of about boats.


 I thought, since we need to get into detail, that I'd go ahead and list out the items found randomly in pots, grass, under rocks, etc.

Items found randomly
Note that these items are found only once they're applicable to the hero, i.e., you don't find arrows before you have a bow. Also note that in rooms in dungeons that require a refillable item, such as ammo or magic, that particular item can be found in jars/pots in that room.

Hearts
Pick up a heart to replenish one heart of health.
Their rarity will depend on how difficult the enemies are, to balance it.

Rupees
Increments found randomly: 1, 5, and 20. Randomly finding a 20 is extremely rare, and those and increments higher than that are reserved for rewards.

Magic Jars
Small green bottles that replenish an increment of your magic meter. Small jars replenish like an eighth, maybe a quarter, big magic jars replenish it all.
Rarity would depend on how many items use magic, and how necessary they are, but fairly uncommon.
Rooms with puzzles requiring magic would have pot that definitely have magic jars in them.

Deku Seeds
Used as ammo for the slingshot. Found all over the place. Picking up one seed icon refills 5 seeds.

Ember Seeds
Used as a flaming projectile with the slingshot, can catch distant things on fire. Found on ember seed trees and fairly rarely in random places.

Ice Seeds
Used with the slingshot to freeze things. Found on ice seed trees and fairly rarely in random places.

Bombs
Found once you have a bomb bag. Uncommon. Explode things, etc... One bomb icon on the map replenishes 5 bombs.

Arrows
Found once you have the bow, can be used to shoot targets from afar. Picking up one bundle of arrows icon refills 5 arrows in your quiver.
One way to do this is to make it like WW, where you can use a regular arrow and fire it as a fire arrow. Each fire arrow would use up one arrow and a small amount of magic, same with ice arrows. This is unlike the seed system, where you have to find ember and ice seeds, which require no magic... So once you get a bow and arrows, that would be a change. I opt for the bow being optional, because it seems like it doesn't really change that much from a slingshot. TP had both, but you just stopped using the slingshot once you got the bow.

Secret Seashells
Found quite rarely, and sometimes as puzzle rewards. They are saved up for no apparent purpose until you find that they can be traded to upgrade some equipment in a secret out of the way seashell mansion type place. They should DEFINITELY not be used for some type of wagering game, though, because that was obnoxious. LA had it right with finding only 20 in the whole game, and getting a better sword, in my opinion.



So, anybody have other opinions, any feedback?

[Kren]

Kren

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

How about that the Shadow Clock transforms you into temporary objects? so you can hide from enemies and such? but in a funny way, like you transform into a statue of tingle, or into a statue of a Goron etc and you can use those statues to press switches on the ground, I like the drill idea, it could work not sure how haha.

Actually I like also the idea of the forest temple, sounds more original !

[Max.]

Max.

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

So like the stone mask? which I thought looked pretty freaking comical. That's one idea, although, do you think the sheikah would create an item that was comical? They seem like such dark, serious people. They're interesting, they're shrouded in mystery, yet obsessed with the truth. They seem to know about everything, but don't reveal anything about themselves. What kind of item fits that, besides one that dispels illusion, because I've already assigned that to the shadow cog, unless you guys think it'd be better elsewhere.
We could go with items we've seen Sheik have, needles, whip, dagger, but... How would those be different from items we already have, arrows, hookshot, sword... I think focusing on their penchant for shadows, secrecy, truth, or history will give us the best item to assign to the sheikah tribe. Also, if the sheikah dungeon is the last cog, then the item there should be awesome and useful in battle besides puzzles. Most games don't have much to do with the sheikah, so if KoT does, it will stand out so we have to make that part especially awesome, I think. Which is why I'm thinking the Shadow Cloak can let you control specific statues, because they could be powerful and kick ass in battle, create interesting puzzles, mysterious, and you could also have an element of sneaking involved in the shadow cloak too, which is very sheikah.

Also, here's how, at the moment, I think the Goron drill could work. You get bombs early in the game, in Hyrule Town. When You get into the Goron dungeon and find the drill, it could do one of two things.
1) it replaces the bombs, and can drill through bomb walls as well as special walls that are basically the same as mole mitt walls, or 2) It doesn't replace bombs because it can't drill through those walls, it can only drill through mole mitt walls. I think since bombs and mole mitts weren't redundant the way they worked in Minish Cap, the second way is the way to do it.
Here's my new proposal:

Bombs
Found in Hyrule Town, early in the game.

Pressing the button draws out a bomb, and you hold it over you head. Pressing the button again sets the bomb down, pressing the action button throws it (presuming the item and A buttons are different, like in OoT and not OoX. Same as you'd expect.

Goron Drill
Found in the Goron Mines

Pressing the button will whip out the drill and drill the tile in front of you. If there is an enemy there, it will do a good amount of damage, more than the sword. If there is a drill-able wall/rock in front of you, you will reduce it to rubble. After drilling, you pause for a second while the spinning of the drill slows down. If you want to drill through a lot, like if you're going through a mole mitt style area, you can rapidly tap on the button and the drill will spin in place for a second, and then you will drill in a straight line until you stop tapping on the button or run into something you can't drill. This function works the same way Pegasus boots do, but instead of running fast, you're drilling through specific type of rock, or enemies.
Certain walls and areas can only been traversed by drilling through them with the Goron Drill, and certain enemies can only be defeated with it as well.

[.]

.

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

I like the idea of the Goron drill. It seems like it would work like a mix between Pegasus boots and the mole mits.

I don't particularly like the idea of the spinner. I don't think it would work well in a 2D game.

I also think the slingshot (if used at all) should be separate from the bow and arrow. It might make more sense to have the slingshot upgrade to the scattershot (from skyward sword) and the bow and arrow to upgrade to light arrows or fire and ice arrows.

Some items that might be good to have are the shovel, the magnetic gloves, the hookshot, and of course the usual items like bombs etc.

Building off the idea of a Sheihah item, what about the Lens of Truth? It's rather mysterious and resembles the Sheikah eye.

[Max.]

Max.

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

Well, as far as the slingshot / bow, then I think we should pick one or the other. I felt like in OOX, the slingshot was the same as the bow in TCM, except with more ammo options. So my feelings are that that using both without them being an upgrade is redundant. I'd say nix to the slingshot and just go for the bow with upgrades in the form of fire and ice arrows, or else if we want to be a little more original, not that the slingshot is original, just used less, go with that and ember and ice seeds.
Personally, I'm down for the slingshot, no bow. Other opinions?

And the spinner would, I suppose, need to be tested, but I think it would work well, with its main functions being unlocking doors, so as a progress pacer kind of thing, and as a really cool dash function. We've always had rolling, but this would be faster and further, and kind of go along with the agile thief thing we've got going on. Then its secondary functions would be the cog abilities, which I feel are tantamount to the medallions of ALTTP, ether, bombos, etc.
So although I am a little biased because I came up with the idea, I think the spinner could work well. The question is, is the items team so small that if two people differ, we're at an impasse? Haha, we can work it out. Why do you think it wouldn't work well in 2D?

About the lens of truth, that could work. I think it works alright in 2D, as much as it does in 3d, anyway. Personally, I never liked it because it was always ALMOST optional, because the game would work fine without it, you could technically still get through, it was just like one or two spots that were too hard to navigate invisible stuff. It annoyed me a little bit, and didn't actually DO anything, just showed you why you kept falling down the damn holes under the well.

Also, yeah, those shovel, magnetic gloves, etc are good items to have, but at this point, we should elaborate and be more specific, when do you think the player should get them, what functions would they have, and the like?
I'm just one member of the items team, so this definitely needs other people's input, but here's how I'm feeling about the major items.
There should be about two per area of the game, that is, Deku Forest, Goron Mtns. According to the current design info page, they go Hyrule Town, Deku, Zora, Goron, Sheikah/Gerudo. Here's my idea about the major items, and why.

Hyrule Town: Spinner, bombs- the spinner because if others like this idea, it'll get upgrades after every dungeon, so it needs to be received early. The bombs because the Goron drill has a similar function so they shouldn't be received in proximity.

Kokiri Forest: slingshot, hookshot. The slingshot because it's a forestry item, and leaving the player without a projectile weapon for too long is pretty limiting. Hookshot because it'll be used to traverse the canopy and trees in the forest dungeon.

Zora Domain: Blue tunic breathing thing, ??? Breathing for use in the presumably partially under water water dungeon, and I don't have any ideas for which item would be most useful in this dungeon.

Goron mountains: Magnetic Gloves, Goron Drill. The gloves because Gorons are associated with metal and earth, so magnetic gloves could have MANY applications here, I think, climbing walls, manipulating switches and stuff, moving around like the iron boots in TP maybe? I might be thinking a little too 3D. And the Goron drill for obvious reasons.

That's what I've got so far, I'll edit this when I get more ideas later. Opinions? Especially about the spinner, I really like the idea, but it'd be pretty major since it keeps being upgraded, so if more than one other person doesn't like it, it should probably go down. Not like I don't care what you think Jimn, it's just that right now the vote is one to one. Well, I don't know which way the golden chu chu and Kren feel, although they didn't express any aversion.

[.]

.

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

I think it would make the most sense for the spinner to come from the Goron Mountains since it's mechanical, but this would conflict with the upgrades. We would also need to have a reason for the spinner to be a special item. One upgrade would be normal, but more than that would make it stand out. Maybe it could have one upgrade and that upgrade could be in the Goron mountains. You may need it because of new switches it doesn't fit.

I think you're right about the different areas. Each should have two items, but do you think that some should be item upgrades or those should be in addition to two items from each area? It's really tempting to have a lot of items because it's hard to choose, but then many have similar functions.

[Max.]

Max.

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

About the spinner in regards to upgrades, I use the term upgrades, but it's not quite what I mean. The spinner is more like the Ocarina of Time, in that you get it and it can initially do one thing, but throughout the game you get different items (songs/cogs) that allow the initial item (spinner/ocarina) more functions. So if we go through with this, the spinner would have the same amount of importance as the Ocarina in regards to functionality. In regards to plot importance, we could vary it totally. It could be mentioned as the legendary spinner which the hero of legend will use to stop Gannon, or mentioned as this item being shipped from Goron Mountain to the castle, which Link happened to steal and it comes in handy for him, but it's just an item some Goron built.
It's like the bow, it's not exceptional and doesn't technically get any upgrades, but you find fire, ice, and light arrows.
So I don't exactly mean upgrades, just that the spinner works with the cogs you get at the end of each dungeon to give them in-game functionality.

Also, as for being from Goron City, it doesn't have to be IN Goron city to be from Goron city. It can just be traveling from there, like, being shipped, or with a Goron merchant.

As for upgrades, some could factor in to the two for each area, but only if they significantly change the functionality of the item so it can solve more and different puzzles. Like, getting a bigger bomb bag, no, that shouldn't count. It'd be disappointing and wouldn't change much, but going from the Roc's feather to the Roc's cape would, because it changes the functionality of the item, in the way and distance you jump, you can do different things with it.

Furthermore, back to the lens of truth, the other reason I don't like it is because if we go with this cogs with functionality idea, the lens of truth's function would be covered by that. But besides that, any other sheikah items? Also, how do you feel about the little item order I noted in that last post: spinner, slingshot/bow, hookshot, breathing item, ???item in water temple, magnetic gloves, Goron drill.

Also, here's my item write up thing for my idea of a sheikah cloak.

Shadow Cloak
Found in the Sheikah dungeon
Pressing the button puts on the cloak. Pressing it again takes it off. When the shadow cloak is on, you are invisible to enemies, but can't use your sword or other items. You can walk through enemies and certain walls and objects (which are only illusions). Furthermore, you can walk into certain statues, and if you take the cloak off while inside the statue, you can control it, similar to the dominion rod.
Using the cloak consumes a lot of magic. Or maybe just some magic.

Notes: The walls you can walk through which are illusions are impassible without the shadow cloak, because your mind is so convinced of their existence that it psychosomaticaly won't move through them. We could also do something like this with an enemy that doesn't really exist, some kind of sheikah wraith that is only an illusion, but since your mind is convinced of its existence, your body takes damage anyway. That might be cool.

Also, the statues you can control: they're special statues made by ancient sheikah. When you're controlling them, you can hop around like how statues do with the dominion rod or command melody, and pressing the action button makes the statue do their attack. Perhaps different statues have different attack functions, some can knock down walls, others can crush enemies, etc. like how there were different statues in Twilight Princess that could do different things, some attacked, others were just platforms.


So, what do you guys think?

[MG-Zero]

MG-Zero

Re: ATTN: Items Group: Items Brainstorm

Seems like you two are the only two active in the items group, so it appears to be just you two!  I'll jump in then to provide some assistance until someone else jumps on

I like this spinner idea a lot.  It will definitely open up A LOT of new possible puzzle types.  It's also quite a nice extension to the lens of truth, regarding the shadow cog.  Of course as with anything new, it's something that needs to be prototyped and play tested.  I also assume we're going for a linear dungeon flow.  This needs to be taken into consideration for puzzles since the cogs will essentially effect which dungeons you're able to go to.

As for the item order, I absolutely agree that the spinner with this kind of functionality should be the first item.

i love big weenies and i cannot lie