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Author Topic: Burning the flag of the USA in means of protest!  (Read 9823 times)

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Re: Burning the flag of the USA in means of prot...
« Reply #60 on: August 04, 2006, 10:00:03 pm »
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What you guys are suggesting is borderline absurd: that the flag is simply a piece of cloth.  You're so bogged down in mislead definitions (ie. the American flag is a simple piece of cloth), that you're overlooking the actual issue (besides the flag doesn't even have to be made from cloth... it can be plastic, paper, etc.  And guess what?  There's actually a definition for flag and it's not "piece of cloth").  I know it's very socialistic and liberal for me to want to ban burning a piece of cloth, and a "freedom of expression", but it's our FLAG.  We don't pledge to a piece of cloth.  We pledge to our flag.

Our flag, by definition, is not a piece of cloth.  It's our flag.
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Re: Burning the flag of the USA in means of prot...
« Reply #61 on: August 04, 2006, 10:02:13 pm »
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Quote from: 2awesome4apossum on August 04, 2006, 10:00:03 pm
What you guys are suggesting is borderline absurd: that the flag is simply a piece of cloth.  You're so bogged down in mislead definitions (ie. the American flag is a simple piece of cloth), that you're overlooking the actual issue (besides the flag doesn't even have to be made from cloth... it can be plastic, paper, etc.  And guess what?  There's actually a definition for flag and it's not "piece of cloth").  I know it's very socialistic and liberal for me to want to ban burning a piece of cloth, and a "freedom of expression", but it's our FLAG.  We don't pledge to a piece of cloth.  We pledge to our flag.

Our flag, by definition, is not a piece of cloth.  It's our flag.

I don't care what it is. You should be allowed to burn it.
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Re: Burning the flag of the USA in means of prot...
« Reply #62 on: August 04, 2006, 10:07:24 pm »
Quote from: 2awesome4apossum on August 04, 2006, 10:00:03 pm
What you guys are suggesting is borderline absurd: that the flag is simply a piece of cloth.  You're so bogged down in mislead definitions (ie. the American flag is a simple piece of cloth), that you're overlooking the actual issue (besides the flag doesn't even have to be made from cloth... it can be plastic, paper, etc.  And guess what?  There's actually a definition for flag and it's not "piece of cloth").  I know it's very socialistic and liberal for me to want to ban burning a piece of cloth, and a "freedom of expression", but it's our FLAG.  We don't pledge to a piece of cloth.  We pledge to our flag.

Our flag, by definition, is not a piece of cloth.  It's our flag.

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lag1   Audio pronunciation of "flag" ( P )  Pronunciation Key  (flg)
n.

   1. A piece of cloth, usually rectangular, of distinctive color and design, used as a symbol, standard, signal, or emblem.

true, it isn't just a piece of cloth. But then, if it were how could someone protest by burning it...
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Re: Burning the flag of the USA in means of prot...
« Reply #63 on: August 04, 2006, 10:22:11 pm »
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signal
Interesting word choice.

EDIT: Assuming it's not only reffering to flags of surrender and such.
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Re: Burning the flag of the USA in means of prot...
« Reply #64 on: August 04, 2006, 10:29:43 pm »
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Way to act like a dooshbag 2awesome4apossum; please do not hide behind your blanket of society when that is what you yourself believe in.  If society saw it as terrorism, then those cases would have been terrorism, but higher minds prevailed.  Just because terrorists also burn flags, that does not mean that everyone who burns a flag is a terrorist.  The ones you are probably thinking of are the ones that a from a foreign country anyway so a United States amendment really would not stop them now would it. 

Also, flag burning is not peaceful?  Why is that, is it because there is fire and the potential to spread fire?  A flag, even with accelerants, cannot burn through concrete or whatever the protest is on.  The only one in danger is the igniter.  It is safer than you think. 

About being nude, it is banned it public places to protect the rights of children and preserve decency.  The government has provisions which allow for there to be communities to be naked in.  These are seperated from other communities to protect the rights of the people who do not want to see it while allowing those who want to do it the right to do it. 
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Re: Burning the flag of the USA in means of prot...
« Reply #65 on: August 04, 2006, 11:01:52 pm »
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Way to act like a dooshbag 2awesome4apossum
Someone has a grudge against me, lol.

I'm such a dooshbag for calling an idea borderline absurd.

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please do not hide behind your blanket of society when that is what you yourself believe in.
How does that make sense?

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preserve decency
Decency by your definition!  I know there's sort of a double-conotation to that word, but many consider burning a flag indecent (if we look at the root word).  Kids would walk around naked anyway if they were the ones who were supposed to make that choice. ^_^

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These are seperated from other communities to protect the rights of the people who do not want to see it while allowing those who want to do it the right to do it. 
Which is why I'd allow flag burning on private property, not on public.

Thank you for illustrating my analogy, better :)

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Also, flag burning is not peaceful?  Why is that, is it because there is fire and the potential to spread fire?  A flag, even with accelerants, cannot burn through concrete or whatever the protest is on.  The only one in danger is the igniter.  It is safer than you think. 

Dictionary.com on Peace:
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3. Freedom from quarrels and disagreement; harmonious relations: roommates living in peace with each other.
4.  Public security and order: was arrested for disturbing the peace.

If you'd read my entire explanation, you should know the context I was reffering to.
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Re: Burning the flag of the USA in means of prot...
« Reply #66 on: August 04, 2006, 11:21:22 pm »
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Do not play dumb.  That statement makes perfect sense; it is referring to you trying to make a statement that you believe in and then saying that this is what society thinks to get away from your opinion.  In that way, if someone says that you think that you will say that you do not, and if someone says you do not, then you will agree with them.  It is a way to say something without worrying what you say.  Society thinks you are a !@#$% retard, it told me so.

Decency is there and should be obvious to you.  Would you ride a packed subway with a naked person next to you?  It would violate your space, and it would violate the rights of others.  It also exposes children to things that they should not be exposed to.       

Since everyone is an American, they should be allowed to burn flags where they want, so long as it is not a fire hazard.  By moving protest away, the government would in fact be nearly silencing it.  Do you think TV crews would go to your house to see what you do there?  No, that is a waste of time and would be dumb.  If you want to physically protest the government, it helps to be at the government property. 
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officespace16
Re: Burning the flag of the USA in means of prot...
« Reply #67 on: August 16, 2006, 02:26:32 pm »
Quote from: MaJoRa on July 18, 2006, 08:11:09 pm
You guys are acting like its an issue. Get over it for christs sake, its a flag, a bit of cloth with a pattern on it. It represents NOTHING. Its just a flag, at the end of the day, if some guy wants to buy a flag, and burn it, oh well. I mean realistically, its called FREEDOM OF SPEACH. Its just an expression of views, that does not harm anyone. It really goes against everything your country is supposed to stand for not to let them burn them in protest.

it's an american thing, everywhere else, who cares? like in france. the only french flags are owned by french buisnesses and gov't buildings
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Re: Burning the flag of the USA in means of prot...
« Reply #68 on: August 16, 2006, 04:34:17 pm »
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Decency is there and should be obvious to you.  Would you ride a packed subway with a naked person next to you?  It would violate your space, and it would violate the rights of others.  It also exposes children to things that they should not be exposed to.
Would you ride a packed subway with a person burning a flag next to you?  It would violate your space, and the rights of others.  It also exposes children to things that they should not be exposed to.

Because hateful flag burning isn't something kids ought to be exposed to.
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Re: Burning the flag of the USA in means of prot...
« Reply #69 on: August 16, 2006, 05:56:35 pm »
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Children do not understand the flag nor do they know enough about the history of the nation to care.

About the naked guy on a subway, that was referring to if people could be nude in public and how it would violate the rights of others in near proximity.  You obviously cannot burn a flag in a crowd unless there is a wide enough opening to do so; in most cases, there is an open area.  Allowing people to be naked in public, looking past sanitary issues, would make it uncomfortable for people who chose to wear clothes and could be harmful to children.  Flagburning does not violate the rights of others if done appropriately.
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Re: Burning the flag of the USA in means of prot...
« Reply #70 on: August 16, 2006, 07:48:15 pm »
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About the naked guy on a subway, that was referring to if people could be nude in public and how it would violate the rights of others in near proximity.  You obviously cannot burn a flag in a crowd unless there is a wide enough opening to do so; in most cases, there is an open area.
So what about being naked in an open area?  Besides, flagburning does make it uncomfortable, and could be harmful to children.

(and that's not even why indecent exposure's illegal)
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Pyru
Re: Burning the flag of the USA in means of prot...
« Reply #71 on: August 16, 2006, 07:53:27 pm »
Quote from: 2awesome4apossum on August 16, 2006, 07:48:15 pm
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About the naked guy on a subway, that was referring to if people could be nude in public and how it would violate the rights of others in near proximity.  You obviously cannot burn a flag in a crowd unless there is a wide enough opening to do so; in most cases, there is an open area.
So what about being naked in an open area?  Besides, flagburning does make it uncomfortable, and could be harmful to children.

(and that's not even why indecent exposure's illegal)

Indecent exposure should so be legal. If people don't wanna walk around nude, they don't have to.

And if people are gonna harass people sexually, well, that's illegal anyway.

As for the flag: I still say it shouldn't be a seperate offence! If you're gonna burn anything in a public place, if it's going to be a danger to anyone else, regardless of whether or not the object is a flag, it should be illegal.
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Re: Burning the flag of the USA in means of prot...
« Reply #72 on: August 17, 2006, 03:51:04 am »
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As for the flag: I still say it shouldn't be a seperate offence! If you're gonna burn anything in a public place, if it's going to be a danger to anyone else, regardless of whether or not the object is a flag, it should be illegal.
It'd be a fair compromise to say that you can't make a fire on government property.

Public's another debate: but seriously, how on earth could you support flag burning on GOVERNMENT property?

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Indecent exposure should so be legal. If people don't wanna walk around nude, they don't have to.
But you're forgetting the science behind it all, I'm afraid.
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