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Author Topic: [DEMO 0.18 NOW OUT] Alttp - Horn of Balance  (Read 162659 times)

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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #40 on: June 07, 2009, 09:38:04 pm »
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[3] Poking wall:
Problem: If you're powering up your sword (holding the sword button) and holding a directional key while poking a wall, then if you let off of the sword key while still pressing that directional key into the wall, Link will continue to hold his sword out, poking the wall. His sword will continue to charge up when doing this, even though you are no longer pressing the sword key.
Fix: Not sure how you're coding this so I haven't got much of an idea how to fix it.
However, I did notice that, in the original, poking the wall does not reset your powering up of the sword like you have it do in your game. Instead, the original game pauses the powering up for a short time every time you tap the wall, then it continues to power up. Just in case you want to make it EXACTLY like the original. If not, your way is totally fine.
Hhmm. Interesting. I'll have to look into it, but it doesn't look to complicated to fix. My guess is that releasing the sword button negates charging, but not (yet) poking. I'm using a single variable called Link_Status for all of link's actions. It should be just a matter of adding a new condition to releasing the sword button. "If released while poking do the same as when released while charging", or something similar.
Continuing to charge while poking would cause some small problems I'd need to overcome so I'll leave it as it is.


I don't really know anymore what the SNES version of ALttP did with sword poking, but the GBA version cancels the sword charge when the sword is poked against the wall.
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #41 on: June 07, 2009, 09:58:51 pm »
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[3] Poking wall:
Problem: If you're powering up your sword (holding the sword button) and holding a directional key while poking a wall, then if you let off of the sword key while still pressing that directional key into the wall, Link will continue to hold his sword out, poking the wall. His sword will continue to charge up when doing this, even though you are no longer pressing the sword key.
Fix: Not sure how you're coding this so I haven't got much of an idea how to fix it.
However, I did notice that, in the original, poking the wall does not reset your powering up of the sword like you have it do in your game. Instead, the original game pauses the powering up for a short time every time you tap the wall, then it continues to power up. Just in case you want to make it EXACTLY like the original. If not, your way is totally fine.
Hhmm. Interesting. I'll have to look into it, but it doesn't look to complicated to fix. My guess is that releasing the sword button negates charging, but not (yet) poking. I'm using a single variable called Link_Status for all of link's actions. It should be just a matter of adding a new condition to releasing the sword button. "If released while poking do the same as when released while charging", or something similar.
Continuing to charge while poking would cause some small problems I'd need to overcome so I'll leave it as it is.


I don't really know anymore what the SNES version of ALttP did with sword poking, but the GBA version cancels the sword charge when the sword is poked against the wall.

The SNES version is the one I was referring to, and it does not cancel the sword charge, it merely pauses it. I didn't know they changed it in the GBA version. Interesting.
I actually like the GBA version better and Martijn dh has already already told me that he's going to keep it so that it cancels the sword charge when you poke a wall, like the GBA one does, which I think makes more sense anyway. That's probably why they changed it in the GBA version. I didn't know if he wanted to make it exactly like the original ALttP or not, but I found that he is keeping it VERY close while improving on a few things as well.
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #42 on: June 08, 2009, 07:21:48 pm »
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pretty good build, the stair sounds were weird like mentioned and it bugged me i couldnt pick up a bottle and throw it =P very good so far keep it up!
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #43 on: June 08, 2009, 07:45:57 pm »
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The throwing bit is something I've been putting off for ages. It's a lot of work and I want to do it right in one go when I release it. To give some more insight: So far I've got all sprites I need (just need to change the color for the different tunics), the walking with hands up is mostly finished, I've implemented two types of solids (to be able to throw stuff over small ledges but not through walls etc.) and there is a ton of notes with ideas for implementing the rest. I'll probably replace the containers (and other such items) with a dummy object so it can't break while held. All I need to figure out is how to work with different sized containers and different weights (=> gloves) and contain it neatly within one script.

The sounds on the stairs are the same as in the original. If you, or anybody else on the site, can get me some "better" sounds feel free to post them. If I like them I'll add them. Since I know nothing of creating my own sounds, that's the best I can do for you.
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #44 on: June 08, 2009, 07:55:29 pm »
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the sound seems slower sounding than normal
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #45 on: June 08, 2009, 10:52:06 pm »
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the sound seems slower sounding than normal

I didn't really notice. Though some of Link's actions did seem a tad bit slower than normal (mostly feels perfect though). And the breaking animation for the pots is faster than in the original. I really should play the GBA version instead of just the SNES and see how that one works as well. And the dashing doesn't feel right upon hitting the wall, probably because you haven't implemented the screen shaking yet. It also seems like Link shouldn't be able to recover so fast after hitting the wall, but I need to play the original to see how that one feels.

Just some thoughts. Like I said, I'm a perfectionist. XD

I understand that this is a tech demo, so you'll probably fix all those minor things when you get around to it.
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #46 on: June 09, 2009, 05:54:26 am »
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It's alright. If you find more be sure to let me know. Just keep in mind that it doesn't have to be exactly the same as the original.

The screen shaking is already on my list. I could give it some more priority if you want.
The breaking animation is now 1,5 times as long.
I'll have to give some thought to the sound on the stairs and an additional recovery time after crashing.
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #47 on: June 09, 2009, 06:41:38 am »
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Just keep in mind that it doesn't have to be exactly the same as the original.
I'll keep that in mind. I just want to help you make this into a masterpiece. :)

You don't have to make screen shaking a priority, just as long as it gets done some time.
And thanks for fixing the breaking animation.

A few other things I noticed:
[1] When you're charging your sword and you touch a pot with it, it'll shatter the pot. It just feels weird that a simple touch would shatter a pot. Can't you just make it like the grass where only slashes cut it? The way you have it makes the pots feel like they aren't really pots. It almost feels like the pots are so fragile that you should be able to walk into them to break them.
[2] The speed of the slash animation while facing down is perfect, but left, up and right all feel a little slow. Is this just me?
[3] ALttP has it so you don't have to wait for the sword animation to finish completely before slashing again, but yours makes Link wait for the swing to be complete before he can swing again. It kind of makes the player feel like they have less control over Link. I found myself wanting to swing the sword more rapidly at times. Fixing this might help with problem 2 above.
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #48 on: June 09, 2009, 07:27:52 pm »
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I had the day off today so I worked on the game a little. Luckely most of these suggestions aren't that hard to look into.

1) Pots can now only be destroy by the slash, the 360 slash, poking and/or running into them with the sword. However, when you poke a container to shreds it uses the normal poking sound and effect. This doesn't appear to be an easy fix so I'll leave like this for now. See for yourself when the next demo is out. If anybody finds it bothersome I'll look at it again.

2+3) The difference in swinging speeds has to do with the lengths of the animations. One is 6 frames, the others 9. I'm looking into it.

FrozenFire: I'll see if I can't take a look at the screen anyway. We'll need it for the boss fights anyway.

UPDATE: All swing animations have now been changed to 7 frames. It's a small difference but I believe it will be enough. I tested the alternatives but setting everything at 6 frames didn't feel right and cancelling an attack midway for a new attack didn't look realistic either.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2009, 08:17:02 pm by Martijn dh »
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #49 on: June 09, 2009, 09:08:47 pm »
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FrozenFire: I'll see if I can't take a look at the screen anyway. We'll need it for the boss fights anyway.

True. btw, I hope you don't need those sprites soon. I've barely had a chance to get started. Though I have figured out what enemies to use as references. I was lucky to find an enemy that uses the exact armor, so I can use that for the sideways and upward directions. The head and feet will be the hardest, but still not too very hard.

UPDATE: All swing animations have now been changed to 7 frames. It's a small difference but I believe it will be enough. I tested the alternatives but setting everything at 6 frames didn't feel right and cancelling an attack midway for a new attack didn't look realistic either.

Sounds much better. When are you planning on releasing a new demo with all of these fixes?
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #50 on: June 10, 2009, 05:51:53 pm »
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FrozenFire: I'll see if I can't take a look at the screen anyway. We'll need it for the boss fights anyway.

True. btw, I hope you don't need those sprites soon. I've barely had a chance to get started. Though I have figured out what enemies to use as references. I was lucky to find an enemy that uses the exact armor, so I can use that for the sideways and upward directions. The head and feet will be the hardest, but still not too very hard.

UPDATE: All swing animations have now been changed to 7 frames. It's a small difference but I believe it will be enough. I tested the alternatives but setting everything at 6 frames didn't feel right and cancelling an attack midway for a new attack didn't look realistic either.

Sounds much better. When are you planning on releasing a new demo with all of these fixes?

No, I don't need the sprites anytime soon. The dungeon isn't even half finished yet. I can start programming the boss anytime I want but it'll be a while before he can be implemented anyway.

The next demo was planned for this weekend. The inbetween fixes took some time, but I may still make it. There are just a couple of problems left with the respawning enemies / containers that need fixing. Nothing too mayor.
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #51 on: June 13, 2009, 12:33:22 pm »
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As requested the new demo. I'm still working on some small fixes but I figured I'm always working on some small fixes. XD

The largest changes/additions in this in this demo include:
- Another new enemy (the plant thingy)
- Customizable controls
- The game now closes by pressing esc on the game select screen.
- Respawning enemies and pots
- Added a random item generator (only actually used for the grass and the enemies)
- Lot's of other small fixes and changes.

Known issues:
- Walking outside will respawn keys.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2009, 04:28:10 pm by Martijn dh »
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #52 on: June 13, 2009, 06:59:48 pm »
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Well, I just downloaded the demo. This is some really good stuff! I'm really glad to be working on it with you.

However, I did notice some things. First of all, there is some weird sprite distortion with Link's walking animations. Occasionally Link gets all blurred and messed up, I don't know why. Also, there is some weirdness with collision, specifically with how far away some enemies can hit you from (for example, the tentacle guys would hit me when I could have sworn I wasn't that close), and Link's sword doesn't seem to hit quite far enough. There are also some things that just feel a little off, like the default controls, and some of the animations (go play LttP and watch the speeds of animations and such in that game, it'll help you get the feel right here).

Also, is the dungeon completable (well, somewhat at least, I know you don't have some rooms done)? Maybe it's because I was trying to just blaze through, but I got to a room with a torch that I could have sworn I was supposed to light, but I didn't have a lamp.

Anyway, this is really, really good, one of the best fan games/engine's I've seen, and it's further along and more polish that most fan games get.
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #53 on: June 15, 2009, 06:06:55 pm »
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Thanks for the compliments.

I don't own the original game anymore. I'll get it for the Wii again eventually but I find it best to not play and compare for two reasons. One: my self motivation would plummet. So much to do in so little time. XD Not to mention the complexity of the things not yet done. Secondly because I'm not trying to copy the game completly. That's impossible. The goal is to create a game that has solid gameplay on it's own. It'll always be considered a clone, but I look at it as a tribute.

PS: I know about the controls. That's why I moved customizable controls up on the list. Please, feel free to experiment with it and tell me what you feel are better controls. I might also do saving pretty soon to make it so you don't have to reset the controls every time.

Anyway. On to those issues you mentioned.
I can't fix the blurring or the collisions. The blurring is probably computer related and I can't help with that. The collisions are pixel perfect. It just feels inaccurate. I have noticed this before and I might look into it some more when the first dungeon is nearing completion. The same goes for the sword swinging. I noticed it and will look deeper into it when the dungeon is nearly done.

As for now. I'll be glitch hunting these comming days. After that I hope to include some more features again. Here are the glitches I found, have fixed or am working on:
- Respawning keys by exiting the dungeon (fixed)
- Not resetting of conditional doors and pressure plates when exiting the dungeon (fixed)
- Items dissappear but leave shadows behind (fixed)
- Map menu shows incorrect data (fixed)
- The Master Control Tile dissappears because dissappearing items (fixed)
- Items dissappear while in pauze mode (fixed)
- Reviving from death does not yet reset the image of a bottle very if you have that one equipped (fixed)
- Poking a container results in the poking visual and sound (???)

UPDATE: There is no end to the game right now. That room with the torch is as far as you can get. I haven't programmed the lantern yet so there isn't much to do. After we've finished those 4 rooms (one excluded) you'll be able to open the master chest and see a early credits screen which has already been made. Demo's after that will probably have the same goal but each time with slightly more stuff you have to do to get there. The final demo will feature the boss in the final rooms beyond.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2009, 07:56:59 pm by Martijn dh »
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #54 on: June 15, 2009, 11:57:01 pm »
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...this is really, really good, one of the best fan games/engine's I've seen, and it's further along and more polish that most fan games get.

I totally agree, and that's why I decided to pitch in and help in any way I could. I think this project has tons of potential.

Also, Martijn dh, I have just finished my final exam and I'm officially on summer break! Yay! XD So I'm actually working on those sprites right now. I just wanted to let you know.

Also, I'm downloading the newest demo. I will see if I can find any other bugs in the game that you haven't already listed.

EDIT:

I just found a glitch. If you dash at a wall, hit it and bounce back then slash your sword right before you touch the ground, Link will remain levitated above his shadow. The more you do this the more levitated Link gets. I attached a pic of what happens when its repeated. You'll notice that Link is really high above his shadow. I'm guessing that you could probably press the menu button and have the same effect? Or possibly another button.
You just need to make sure Link lands back in place of his shadow before he can do anything else because it's stopping him from landing fully.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2009, 08:22:21 am by FrozenFire »
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #55 on: June 16, 2009, 06:15:19 pm »
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Okay, that should be easy enough to fix. I'll get right on it. I've fixed the last problem with the sword poking on containers so you already consider all listed glitches fixed.

Btw, you can all call me Martijn if you want. The letters dh just stand for my last name.
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #56 on: June 22, 2009, 04:43:13 pm »
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Just a small updating post this time. I'll post pics when I'm off this temperary datalimit.

I've now added a workable "sword beam" to the master sword (when you're at full health). I had to make some concessions on the visuals and the masking so I'm really eager to hear how you guys like it (when I release another demo). Just a question in between though. In the original game: what happened when you used the "beam" into the distance? I've now made it so that it keeps going till it hits something tall enough, but that might be a while in the larger area's. It's more realistic this way but maybe less fun probably. So does anybody know how they compensated it in the original?

Beyond that I'm working on implementing some of Raen's rooms and the surrounding area. So you'll definatly have more to explore next time.
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #57 on: June 24, 2009, 04:50:41 pm »
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In LttP I think the sword beam disappeared when it went off-screen. I'm not sure on that one, though, I don't have access to a copy right at this moment.
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #58 on: June 24, 2009, 05:33:43 pm »
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Great. You're back. Time to formulate some more requests XD Well, I've got an exam tomorrow so it'll probably become tomorrow afternoon.

I figured as much with the beams. A beam now appears when you have the correct sword, full health and when no other beam object is active. I guess I'll change that last condition to "when there is no beam active within the visible screen". Or something along those lines if the sound still sounds okay with multiple beams.
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Re: [Demo] Alttp-style game / tech demo -- No na...
« Reply #59 on: June 24, 2009, 05:41:43 pm »
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I'm not back, per se. I'm still away from home, but with some access to a computer. I won't actually be home until the 27th.
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