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ZFGC.com => Updates => Topic started by: MG-Zero on August 24, 2015, 12:42:34 pm

Title: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: MG-Zero on August 24, 2015, 12:42:34 pm
NCFC starts today and King of Thieves is making an appearance!  Check out our booth at:

http://nintendocfc.com/booth.html?id=100

And also make sure to check out the other fan games up there :)
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: SpritingBrad on August 24, 2015, 02:09:30 pm
YES! FINALLY ITS OUT!
I will play it right now, just finished the download!  :D
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: MG-Zero on August 24, 2015, 02:11:50 pm
The demo should only take you about 5 or 10 minutes to complete, don't get too excited ;)
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: SpritingBrad on August 24, 2015, 02:54:36 pm
Already did! ;)

I liked the demo overall. I was surprised when I left the hideout and found myself not in the slums xD.

The pickpocket mechanism is awesome! But I had an issue when I was pick-pocketing the old guy and he turned around told me something and Link just froze, he didn´t move, the controls didn´t work... (but that only happened once, then it worked perfectly)


The controls are good, but they could be better, personally. I would change them to:
-Arrow keys: walking
-A key: first item
-B key: Second Item
-D key: sword? (The sword could be put on the item slots like in minish cap)
-W key: roll (right button for menu like in minish cap)
-Q key: (Left button for menu like in minish cap)
-X key: start
-Z key: select

I have the controls like that in the GBA emulator when playing minish cap and it works really well. But hey, that is just my opinion.

Although, what you could do is let the player change the controls as they like.

But it was good, especially the thieves hideout XD!
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: MG-Zero on August 24, 2015, 02:58:01 pm
Thanks for the feedback!  Reason you didn't see the slums is because they're not mapped out in game yet :)  This is strictly a demo exclusive area.

I'll look into the freezing issue, that one I haven't encountered yet.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: FISSURE on August 25, 2015, 12:12:45 am
Trying the demo now, a few things i noticed.

 - The window is really small
- Trying the steal thing, there doesn't seem to be an indication if i stole anything or not, i think i failed stealing from the NPC's as the tutorial party explaining it was a bit confusing for me. I can't seem to steal anything again since i failed i think.
- I also got the pickpocket freeze when talking pickpocketing the old guy, he turned around and link froze.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: MG-Zero on August 25, 2015, 01:44:38 am
Yea I didn't put much of an indication for the demo.

So it looks like the freeze glitch happens when you pick pocket the moment they turn around.  I'm gonna see if I can reproduce this to a science.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: Zhello on August 25, 2015, 04:14:30 am
Yea I didn't put much of an indication for the demo.

So it looks like the freeze glitch happens when you pick pocket the moment they turn around.  I'm gonna see if I can reproduce this to a science.

Nice, that old man was suspect when he got me lol XD
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: TomPel on August 26, 2015, 09:45:02 am
Yeah the controls didn't really work. It's really hard to press D (go right) and C (action button) at the same time. Like Spritonic said, it makes a lot more sense to use the arrow keys. OR if you choose to use WASD controls, then change the action button to be one of the arrow keys.

And when Link walks and starts strafing, he shouldn't change the way he faces. He should always face the same way as the first direction you make him run. And the player should be at the center of the view when possible (the second the player starts moving, the camera should start moving immediately as well).

But yeah, other than that, it was OK.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: MG-Zero on August 26, 2015, 01:20:58 pm
Noted, controls are gonna take priority over the camera but yea you're right, MC does center the player.  I thought it was towards the edges for some reason.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: SpritingBrad on August 26, 2015, 01:50:10 pm
Noted, controls are gonna take priority over the camera but yea you're right, MC does center the player.  I thought it was towards the edges for some reason.

I think you should play MC on an emulator and see how it works, try to replicate the movement of the camera. Also link feels wierd when walking, it needs to be more fluent. I am playing minish cap and the movement of link feels wierd compared to minish cap, have a play on minish cap and then the demo and you will see wha I mean.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: MG-Zero on August 26, 2015, 02:14:38 pm
It's probably a speed thing and direction priority as Tompel noted
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: Diminish on August 26, 2015, 03:55:53 pm
I agree with what Tompel had said. The movement seemed slow, but then again that might be due to screen resolution; e.g., in perceiving more of the available space/distance Link occupies, compared to still objects/walls around him he looks like he is moving slow. It was neat seeing tile work in the demo, and I get that a lot of this is to demonstrate functionality - where polish to stuff would come later. Namely, sprite animations and giving Link a shadow under himself so that he looks a lot less floaty.

The view in Minish Cap does center on Link but if you get to the corner of a room it stops that behavior - as centering the view on Link would have the view trying to draw outside the room or visible area incorrectly.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: MG-Zero on August 26, 2015, 05:13:32 pm
Quote
The movement seemed slow, but then again that might be due to screen resolution;

Definitely part of it.  I was under the impression that the GBA screen resolution was 320x240, but as it turns out it's actually 240x160.  If I change it to this and add a fullscreen option, it might alleviate some of this.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: LorentzChronon on August 26, 2015, 05:17:46 pm
Noted, controls are gonna take priority over the camera but yea you're right, MC does center the player.  I thought it was towards the edges for some reason.

This might fix the Linux bug
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: Miles07 on August 26, 2015, 05:39:18 pm
The view in Minish Cap does center on Link but if you get to the corner of a room it stops that behavior - as centering the view on Link would have the view trying to draw outside the room or visible area incorrectly.

It's the idea that the edges of drawn map area block the camera from continuing. Basically, have the "camera" object be the size of the visible screen, and when it collides with "empty space" (a.k.a. the empty parts outside of the map) then prevent camera movement in that direction. You could even modify this to prevent Link from looking past a bombable or blocked area until he unlocks it, which can trigger the that camera-blocking entity's 'destroy' event. This could even be used for parallax scrolling in the foreground, if you guys want that in your project.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: MG-Zero on August 26, 2015, 10:51:33 pm
By the way guys, the feedback is fantastic and I'm taking all of it into consideration.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: Martijn dh on August 27, 2015, 05:48:34 am
Here is the lifestream made if anybody missed it (check at around 8:00):
http://www.hitbox.tv/video/652938

Some of the comments are a little harshly worded, but don't let that bother you. The guy is always like that.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: Zhello on August 27, 2015, 06:34:38 am
Here is the lifestream made if anybody missed it (check at around 8:00):
http://www.hitbox.tv/video/652938

Some of the comments are a little harshly worded, but don't let that bother you. The guy is always like that.

Yeah, he played my demo too, but the whole dungeon part was grayed out, so it was hard for me to determine, what to fix and what to correct. The only thing I was told about was the dungeon was a bit dark, so I changed that.

What I noticed is, well it's obvious, there is more Mario games than there other games, even Zelda combined lol. It use to be even out before, but I guess Mario is just bigger and easier to make a game out of.
But with criticism and feedback, there is always a window open to go back, remove or modify some items.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: Miles07 on August 27, 2015, 10:47:40 am
What I noticed is, well it's obvious, there is more Mario games than there other games, even Zelda combined lol. It use to be even out before, but I guess Mario is just bigger and easier to make a game out of.
Super Mario Maker might have contributed to the hype. Just sayin'.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: MG-Zero on August 27, 2015, 01:21:39 pm
Just curious, do you guys see the dedication page for Justin when you start up?  I noticed in that guy's video it didn't show.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: Starforsaken101 on August 27, 2015, 01:43:28 pm
No offense but whoever's streaming NCFC makes himself come across as a neckbeard. This is a demo, no !@#$% the controls aren't going to be the best.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: MG-Zero on August 27, 2015, 01:46:39 pm
Probably just feels the need to be insulting so he sounds funny.  I don't really care though, it's just a demo and the issues will be fixed lol
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: Darklink45 on August 27, 2015, 02:18:15 pm
Just finished playing it, a good first demo :)

The issues I found were already mentioned by others, but if I had to nitpick, I'd say that the diagonal movement should be slower like in other Zelda games.
It was nice to finally play it.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: Max. on August 29, 2015, 09:39:14 pm
Just curious, do you guys see the dedication page for Justin when you start up?  I noticed in that guy's video it didn't show.

I got the page. Nice touch : )

I'm psyched to be playing a demo, even if there isn't much! I got the same problem with the old guy. I walked up to his side and tried to talk to him and the game froze. The pickpocketing was initially a bit confusing because the gauge starts full instead of starting empty.

The camera was a big problem. I could literally outrun the camera, walk to far to one direction that I just walked right off the camera. And then if I stopped, I'd stay off screen. Not keeping Link centered didn't work well either as was previously mentioned. I spent way too much time underneath the hearts or item buttons or whatever. Is the camera supposed to be this slow?

Also, the dungeon key counter had priority over the text boxes for me, and whenever I went through doors, I come out on the other side way past the doorway, like in the middle of the grass outside. Dunno if you're aware of those issues.

Anyway, is there actually a temple to the north like the dialogue says? I went into the other building besides the hideout, and there were some tables and a chest I couldn't open.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: MG-Zero on August 29, 2015, 09:48:33 pm
Quote
Is the camera supposed to be this slow?

No, it shouldn't be.  We've only been able to replicate that on one other machine.  Whats your environment set up like?  Windows version and stuff like that.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: Max. on August 29, 2015, 09:59:46 pm
Windows 7, running it on what was a pretty decent ASUS laptop four or five years ago when I bought it. If you tell me where to look I could get you more information.

I ran the demo again and it was a lot harder to run faster than the camera inside the building in the cliff, I couldn't QUITE get off screen before I hit a wall. Outside I could still run right out of the camera's view though.

Also found another one where if I rolled without letting go of the walk direction, even when I stopped Link's walk animation kept going. Couldn't reproduce it after reopening the game though.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: MG-Zero on September 02, 2015, 07:17:52 pm
Max, do you know what graphics card you have?
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: Max. on September 02, 2015, 09:14:19 pm
Does this help?
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: MG-Zero on September 03, 2015, 02:23:29 am
yes, mile grazie!
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: Max. on September 03, 2015, 02:48:16 am
Di certo!
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: MG-Zero on September 03, 2015, 03:35:48 am
So I've decided against fullscreen in favor of an 800x600 window.  I think that'll work out better?  Any objections?
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: Diminish on September 03, 2015, 04:15:57 pm
it really depends on the game's screen resolution you're going with; pixels tend to look nicer if they are integer scaled, for example 240x160 up-scaled into 480x320, 720x480, or possibly even 960x640.
Title: Re: King of Thieves at NCFC!
Post by: MG-Zero on September 03, 2015, 05:04:05 pm
hmm, interesting and a good point.  640x480 or 960x720 might be better options then.  The aspect ratio is proving difficult to maintain in fullscreen mode, so thats why I'm considering scrapping it in favor of a larger window.

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