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Author Topic: Brawl Tourney.  (Read 20354 times)

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Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #120 on: June 05, 2008, 05:09:59 am »
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I'd rather there not be 3 toon links. :/

I'd rather not care since there are more than 2 colors for Toon link and it's pretty inconsequential anyway.
... >:( Is this your tourney?

Anyways i don't care I'd just rather not have 4 links in the tourney as that's gay.
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Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #121 on: June 05, 2008, 05:18:01 am »
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Swiftu, really, it is too late to change anything.  Not only would changing your character to Toon Link make it so there were three Toon Links in the tournament, but Hammer Bro. Mike who handles the images would have to redo the images for your information, and at this stage in planning, such things should be impractical.  If we let you change your information now, then that would open the door for everyone to change their information, and this would be chaos.  Your current choice is a good one and one that I know you will do good with.  Heck, when I last played you, I lost frequently to you because you kept raping my face with Diddy's moves.  Diddy Kong is arguably your best character.

Anyway, yeah, that is what I think.  Also, Regulus, using the term "gay" like that is kind of unjustified and demeaning to those of that lifestyle.
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Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #122 on: June 05, 2008, 05:20:58 am »
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Swiftu, really, it is too late to change anything.  Not only would changing your character to Toon Link make it so there were three Toon Links in the tournament, but Hammer Bro. Mike who handles the images would have to redo the images for your information, and at this stage in planning, such things should be impractical.  If we let you change your information now, then that would open the door for everyone to change their information, and this would be chaos.  Your current choice is a good one and one that I know you will do good with.  Heck, when I last played you, I lost frequently to you because you kept raping my face with Diddy's moves.  Diddy Kong is arguably your best character.

Anyway, yeah, that is what I think.  Also, Regulus, using the term "gay" like that is kind of unjustified and demeaning to those of that lifestyle.
When i said gay i mean stupid.

I am bi anyways...so...
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Swoftu

Super Fighting Robot
Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #123 on: June 05, 2008, 05:28:19 am »
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Sure diddy is okay, but he lacks any good launching moves.

And why would it matter if there were 3 toon links or 5? I should be able to use whatever I feel that I need to win.
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Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #124 on: June 05, 2008, 05:39:05 am »
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When i said gay i mean stupid.

I know what you meant by it, I just find it offensive when people use those two words synonymously.  

Anyway, yeah people, assuming that you were all informed, register each others friend codes in advance of the starting date.  We will get the information out regarding upcoming matches up by the end of Thursday (for me it is nearly 12:30 AM on Thursday right now).

Sure diddy is okay, but he lacks any good launching moves.

And why would it matter if there were 3 toon links or 5? I should be able to use whatever I feel that I need to win.
Do you have any idea how boring it would be for the viewer of the matches to see Toon Link after Toon Link after Toon Link?  This limitation has to be put in place for a good tournament to work.  Look, I sent you PMs at least twice asking what character you wanted and you are very active on the forum and then you finally got back to me on it late.  You could have secured yourself a Toon Link, but you did not.  You chose Diddy, and right now the images have been made and we should not have to backtrack now. 

I do not know what you specifically mean by launch moves, but I bet if you use the bananas more you could have the advantage more easily than you think.

Anyway, I will look into the brackets to see how this would play out in hypothetical scenarios to where you advanced and where you would not.  I'll think about it, but don't have the expectation that I am going to change instantly.
« Last Edit: June 05, 2008, 05:43:27 am by 4Sword »
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Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #125 on: June 05, 2008, 06:18:08 am »
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Look, due to having sustainably 14 due to a certain someone getting banned and another who has scheduling conflicts, all while maintaining the tournament to ZFGC members only as it should be, we have a certain contingency of characters, and the information was already provided to you.  There are 2 Lucas, 2 Toon Links, 2 Snakes, and 2 Sonics.  This means that 8 are duplicates and 6 are originals.  This may not seem that significant really and will give the appearance of being diverse at first.  However, once you get to the second round, without getting into specific probabilities of course as this is just too damn complicated (well I can't remember statistics, it is all fraction work), there is then at least more than one pair of duplicates in the next round.  Meh.

My point about how it would be boring for the observer to watch still stands for the most part.  It is more interesting when the characters in the brackets are as diverse as possible.  I thought more and more about it and looked at how the bracket is structured now, and taking into account that there are two distinct sides to the bracket as it ends with two participants fighting for the top spot, having three Links in the bracket would result in one being on one side and two being on the other.  The two on the other if they fought would eliminate one of them, and if they fought later on, then that would be.  A one-on-one against two characters of the same type would be unlikely unless there is a select disadvantage, fate, and glitches conspired it all.

Also, there is the more of a certain character you have, the more disadvantaged it is to win with that character as more of your opponents will be ready and experienced. 

I will take back what I said about the images as they seem easy enough to make, but alas I am not the one making them, so if Hammer Bro. Mike changes them, you would have to be thankful that he would go through the effort.  It would be a pain in the ass for everyone or at least a significant number of people to switch their information now though as there are two images and some other things that would have to be created for each of those who changed.  Really, Hammer Bro. Mike is doing a lot. 

The thing specifically about Toon Link though is that there are currently 2 participants who chose him, 1 who wanted to be him but settled on Sonic, and you who wants to be him.  If I change it for you, then if this other user has qualms about me saying no to them, then what?  If he is allowed to be Toon Link, and you, and those other two, then if the best circumstances happened for Toon Links, they would pack the final four.  Ironic I know since I am 4Sword, I should think this is cool. 

In response to your request though, I am going to send messages to all participants asking them all if they want to be something else.  Based on their responses and the consultation of the rest of Brawl team (Regulus and I), we will consider what to do from there, but this is really pushing it.  You're lucky I try to please everybody even though doing so realistically almost never happens and is a pain in the ass.  I would prefer if you remained Diddy because that just keeps it interesting and winning is not everything.  However, this is also ZFGC, and Zelda is our bread and butter, so I would be open to more than two Zelda character restriction lifts.

Is this fair?

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Swoftu

Super Fighting Robot
Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #126 on: June 05, 2008, 06:38:18 am »
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who cares what characters are in the final anyway?

you play to win, not to have variety
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CrystalAngel04

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Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #127 on: June 05, 2008, 06:41:16 am »
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Personally the big deal being made over the character selection is laughable.

The argument against changing the characters is for the sake of diversity is just weird... let people play with who they are best at even if there are duplicates. So what if two Toon Links are against each other? Really? Is it an international crisis? No. Besides, no two people use characters in the same way, they each have their own unique style to their characters so battles still will be interesting to watch. Also assuming the entrants are experienced brawlers they would have gone against these characters several times over so the move sets should be nothing new to anyone.

As for the Graphics argument... honestly, unless your going completely nuts with the graphics for the character entries (which just seems like a bit of a waste of time for something relatively small) it should take no more than 10 minutes to whip up a new one assuming a basic template was made.

So thats just my 2 cents.
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Mamoruanime

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Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #128 on: June 05, 2008, 06:42:42 am »
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I agree; it's almost too overcomplicated for something as simple as "select your character" and "play"...

The only requirement for registration should be name :p
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Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #129 on: June 05, 2008, 07:03:58 am »
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Look, I am just thinking about the people who do not play at all but will probably be watching.  They are just as important as those who are participating, well, a little less as they are not as dedicated but still need to be drawn in. 

As for all the comments to people who think I am over-thinking this, I spill ideas out of my head and if you read my last post before this one, I was tearing apart my own arguments due to me being reasonable.  The argument for changing characters for the sake of diversity is a little weird, yes, but my issue with Swiftu was that he was changing his character so late and after all the information was sent out no less.  There has to be a lock-down to prevent people from changing at the last minute obviously.  Ideally, you would be able to select your character with the deadline being before the first match.  However, images do have to be made and Hammer Bro. Mike is not going to be on beck and call for flip-flopping for the sake of fear of loss on the minds of the participant.  I cannot speak personally about making the images because I am not the one making them, and CrystalAngel04, you are biased in that you happened to do things with images all the time and to you it is just second nature. 

As for picking who you can best win with, sure, perhaps I am just a little arrogant in that I could win the whole thing with any character if I prepared well enough.  Who knows.  Like I said in my last post though, I was basically saying that I was going to send all participants a PM saying that they can change the character if they want with no restrictions, well sort of.  I will send that message now.  I am realistically thinking that most people went with their first choice, but meh, if you want to nit-pick.  Nobody does things for the fun of doing things any more, how droll. 

So here is what I am going to do.  I will PM all participants with a current list of changes; well with the exception of me, Regulus, and Swiftu as his new choice has told to me through MSN. 

Edit: Oh, and thank you for your opinions, Swiftu, CrystalAngel04, and Mamoruanime.
« Last Edit: June 05, 2008, 07:06:39 am by 4Sword »
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Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #130 on: June 05, 2008, 07:15:13 am »
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Also, for the sake of selection, here is the current list of all those involved.  Basically, you can pick any character you want, but try to pick a different color than what is already given by someone.  If a participant changes character or character color, you would then be free to use the color that they had previously selected:

ZFGC Username  Brawl Username  Character Choice/Color  Brawl Friendcode 
Regulust  REGLS  Lucas - Dark Green/Red  1719-2890-8017 
4Sword  4SWOR  Snake - Blue  0688-4934-4413 
Kylink  Kyle  Falco - Black  1719-2890-8017 
FISSURE  Fiss  Pit - Normal  2492-4217-0123 
CrystalAngel04  CANGL  Lucario - Normal  0989-1429-3186 
Hammer Bro. Mike  NOB  Link - Red  3523-1727-8440 
Scooternew  Scott  Toon Link - Black  4682-8111-7308 
MG-Zero  Stove  Toon Link - Normal  2449-4292-3277 
luigi  Jon  Lucas - Claus  3523-1727-8440 
Nintendo Maniac 64  NM64  Marth - Normal  1848-1352-0543 
Takuthehedgehog  Taku  Snake - Normal  2964-8243-6562 
Jetstorm4  Jet4  Sonic - Normal  0044-2516-0315 
Swiftu  Clint  Toon Link - Red  4682-8114-3409 
a Hint of Lime (Limey)  LIMEY  Toon Link - Classic Brown/Green 3093-6752-2953 

Edit: Messages sent.
« Last Edit: June 05, 2008, 07:33:53 am by 4Sword »
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Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #131 on: June 05, 2008, 08:17:37 am »
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Look, I am just thinking about the people who do not play at all but will probably be watching.  They are just as important as those who are participating, well, a little less as they are not as dedicated but still need to be drawn in. 

As for all the comments to people who think I am over-thinking this, I spill ideas out of my head and if you read my last post before this one, I was tearing apart my own arguments due to me being reasonable.  The argument for changing characters for the sake of diversity is a little weird, yes, but my issue with Swiftu was that he was changing his character so late and after all the information was sent out no less.  There has to be a lock-down to prevent people from changing at the last minute obviously.  Ideally, you would be able to select your character with the deadline being before the first match.  However, images do have to be made and Hammer Bro. Mike is not going to be on beck and call for flip-flopping for the sake of fear of loss on the minds of the participant.  I cannot speak personally about making the images because I am not the one making them, and CrystalAngel04, you are biased in that you happened to do things with images all the time and to you it is just second nature. 

As for picking who you can best win with, sure, perhaps I am just a little arrogant in that I could win the whole thing with any character if I prepared well enough.  Who knows.  Like I said in my last post though, I was basically saying that I was going to send all participants a PM saying that they can change the character if they want with no restrictions, well sort of.  I will send that message now.  I am realistically thinking that most people went with their first choice, but meh, if you want to nit-pick.  Nobody does things for the fun of doing things any more, how droll. 

So here is what I am going to do.  I will PM all participants with a current list of changes; well with the exception of me, Regulus, and Swiftu as his new choice has told to me through MSN. 

Edit: Oh, and thank you for your opinions, Swiftu, CrystalAngel04, and Mamoruanime.

I'm pretty sure everyone is doing the tourny for fun.
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Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #132 on: June 05, 2008, 08:45:23 am »
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All we are trying to do is set something up and get it done, and even though if it was not said implicitly, the feeling of gimme gimme comes off at this time as being really inconsiderate to those working to put something nice together.  Perhaps the images will be a little bit of a waste of time, but presentation is important to anything that is done visually.  The videos are important as having videos opens up the tournament to those who want to watch; rather than the tournament being exclusively limited to those participating, it is opened up and allowed to be enjoyed by all of ZFGC who wish to observe.  Since the administration is providing the prize, it is best to give back as much to them, in their space, with positive activity and spent time.

And maybe this is just me, but with Snake, I am a Toon Link killer.  His standard moves are all sword which can even be stopped with a punch and mostly with grenades.  Toon Link isn't as great as people make him out to be.  Just because his moves kind of float in the air and swoop around doesn't make you an aerial ace or an acrobat. 
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Hammer Bro. Mike

Hammer Bro. Mike
Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #133 on: June 05, 2008, 01:05:47 pm »
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4 Toon Link's plus Link for me? That's 5 Links! That's crazy. Too many Link's if you ask me, well Toon Link's. I'm glad I didn't stick with Toon Link.

It will look a little bland with 4 Toon Link's though. I would love to see other characters but it's really surprising to see so many people want to use Toon Link. Wow, now I'm starting to be a !@#$% about it. Anyway, so how's everyone? Getting ready for your big days coming up?
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  • Zelda Eternity
Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #134 on: June 05, 2008, 04:01:16 pm »
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What's the big deal with the number of Toon Links? People should play with their best characters. Matches wouldn't be more interesting if there were a more diverse list of characters, matches will be more interesting if people are playing at their best.

Anyway, I'd like to stay Toon Link, black.
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Hammer Bro. Mike

Hammer Bro. Mike
Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #135 on: June 05, 2008, 04:10:45 pm »
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What's the big deal with the number of Toon Links? People should play with their best characters. Matches wouldn't be more interesting if there were a more diverse list of characters, matches will be more interesting if people are playing at their best.

Anyway, I'd like to stay Toon Link, black.
I used to play as Toon Link but my main motive for this game was to play as Link and I'm playing as him again.
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  • Zelda Eternity
Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #136 on: June 05, 2008, 05:00:06 pm »
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Although characters were picked over 10 days ago.

does seem kind of like a last minute change
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Nintendo Maniac 64

Not dead, just a lurker
Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #137 on: June 05, 2008, 05:16:40 pm »
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Should we post if we're staying the same?  Seeing that I'm the only Marth user, I have no reason to switch to someone else.
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Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #138 on: June 05, 2008, 05:33:25 pm »
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I'm staying as normal colored Snake.  :)

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Re: Brawl Tourney.
« Reply #139 on: June 05, 2008, 06:50:03 pm »
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It seems that most people are alright with the character they are right now and that there are some people who are thinking about changing their selection and will get back to me later if they decide.  What was stated in the PM was that if you did not get back to me by June 8th, then your original selection would be what you will be, so saying you were going to remain the same was not really necessary, but I guess it was helpful in that I knew then that you were not holding out with indecision.  So thanks for that.

Also, saying that matches would be more interesting if people were playing with their best characters is a little bit of a weak argument considering that most of us or all of us are not professionals.  I almost expect to see people dodging all the way to the side, running away, and jumping evasively who will claim that they have mad skills.  As for me, I can find ways to win with anyone because winning is not about you beating your opponent through your abilities specifically, but by exploiting their mistakes and capitalizing on that to win.  Most Toon Link n00bs will be above you and try to sword plant which is such a linear attack that getting out of the way and countering is easy.  Matches would not be more interesting for the players I guess if they were not their "best" (it is sad that you cannot be really good with at least more than one character) and characters to some degree were diverse, but like I said, the viewer would find Toon Link after Toon Link to get a little boring, especially since most people attack the same way with him.  I really hope that people prove me wrong though.
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