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Author Topic: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?  (Read 10993 times)

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Crim

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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #40 on: April 30, 2014, 10:18:24 pm »
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I also second Leduardo's idea. Minigames are a great way to get used to game development and whatnot. Maybe a Zelda-based card game?

Zelda Poker FTW

yes.

Respected User Crim that helps far more than you could ever know

glad to help.
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Starforsaken101

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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #41 on: April 30, 2014, 11:01:56 pm »
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I want to play a game with a Blue Eyes White Ganondorf
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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #42 on: April 30, 2014, 11:20:48 pm »
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Zordon's Funky Grass Cutters plz.
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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #43 on: May 01, 2014, 02:24:52 am »
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We could also try scheduling some community events as a stop-gap and see who shows up for stuff

Like play a steam game online together or something, or even an MMO like FF14 (Which I know is pretty popular amongst the userbase here)

Don't forget about the OoT speedrun race idea we had a while back!
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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #44 on: May 01, 2014, 04:16:04 am »
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Yeah I still think that's a good idea. I think we'd have to adjust it to being just a ZFGC dealy though I have too much going on to try to get GDU in on it esp with how much membership bleed over we have
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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #45 on: May 05, 2014, 08:08:25 pm »
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Minigames are always interesting.

The one thing that could be done is create minigames to defeat bosses.

The Crash Bandicoot franchise takes it very well. A lot can be learned from these bosses.



Two competitions could be created, one for minigames and one for unprecedented ways (minigames) to kill the bosses .
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Jeod

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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #46 on: May 07, 2014, 12:32:54 am »
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Try pushing some things that aren't Zelda more. The saying that there's no such thing as too much Zelda is false, especially when hype is slow to generate due to the amount of sub-par games the forums see. Once in a while you get OoT2D and The Shadowgazer tier, and all others lose their motivation.

This place isn't a corporation, so stop having ridiculously high standards that treat it as such. Push smaller games that are easier for new developers to build, rather than require something that Nintendo would make. There's a reason Mario fan games are abundant, and that's because they're simple to build. What you want to do is lower standards to motivate newcomers, and promote tutoring that pushes them to add new elements to the simple stuff to make it more interesting.
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Starforsaken101

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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #47 on: May 09, 2014, 10:27:04 pm »
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Try pushing some things that aren't Zelda more. The saying that there's no such thing as too much Zelda is false, especially when hype is slow to generate due to the amount of sub-par games the forums see. Once in a while you get OoT2D and The Shadowgazer tier, and all others lose their motivation.

This place isn't a corporation, so stop having ridiculously high standards that treat it as such. Push smaller games that are easier for new developers to build, rather than require something that Nintendo would make. There's a reason Mario fan games are abundant, and that's because they're simple to build. What you want to do is lower standards to motivate newcomers, and promote tutoring that pushes them to add new elements to the simple stuff to make it more interesting.

Jeod, you talk as if we control peoples' creativity. We do not. People can make whatever game they want and post it here and we'll discuss it.
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Jeod

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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #48 on: May 10, 2014, 02:18:05 pm »
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All I'm saying is that the atmosphere is intimidating.
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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #49 on: May 18, 2014, 11:42:21 pm »
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All I'm saying is that the atmosphere is intimidating.
Well there isn't much that can be done about that. There will always be a project that comes every once in a while that blows peoples minds.

It is not us that sets those expectations, it is yourself. You see those projects and the reactions to them, then you get the idea that in order to get the same reaction you need to do the same thing.

You cannot compare a zelda game to a mario game, the barrier to entry will always be higher because zelda games by definition are a lot more complex. What you need to do is become smarter about the ideas you choose to develop and how you go about gathering perceived interest.

People get demotivated not by those hyped up projects, but by the fact they spent the last few weeks coding something and nobody is interested. Imagine if that at the beginning instead of coding something, they put aside some time to mockup some screenshots, maybe even produce a trailer to give it that "I've been working on this for several months" sort of feel only to get the same response. Now instead of spending a few weeks on a shitty idea, you've just dodged a bullet.

In the end you realize that zfgc's expectations are actually rather low, after all, this whole website was based on a game that never even reached beyond the stage of a basic engine test.
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Malon

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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #50 on: May 19, 2014, 04:49:26 am »
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I think the main thing that inhibits ZFGC is the fact that most game creators would rather create something new and original that they would be recognized for rather than a fan-game that they could not sell and would probably be seen by a very small amount of people. At the same time, a large number of us have been here for almost if not over a decade and are tethered here more by our overall love of games rather than our love of Zelda. Maybe we should just let ZFGC continue the way it is and enjoy the time (however infrequent) that we can spend together. :)
« Last Edit: May 19, 2014, 10:14:54 pm by Malon »
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Mirby

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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #51 on: May 19, 2014, 08:32:45 am »
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In the end you realize that zfgc's expectations are actually rather low, after all, this whole website was based on a game that never even reached beyond the stage of a basic engine test.
Like I said, we need Demo 4. That'll solve everything :P
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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #52 on: May 23, 2014, 02:46:11 am »
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Sorry for the lack of responses guys, grad school was KILLING me for the last few weeks.  But I have survived it and I have free time again!  With that, my current focus is on the site resources.  See the thread in updates for whats going on with that :)
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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #53 on: June 09, 2014, 12:13:49 pm »
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I know this thread has been silent for a little over 2 weeks, but I have a few things to say, and I just got in a little late (been completely inactive for a while, so I only recently saw this thread). In my defense, this is a topic that was started because of lack of activity. :P

My thoughts on the community project and why I haven't jumped in to help
I am so far behind the project's current status. I don't even know the story of KoT. I just know a few small details. And when I go into the CP section of the forums, it's just a big confusing mess in my eyes. Probably not to the people who have been working on it, but it really is confusing for someone like me who has barely been able to keep up with it. That's a big reason why I haven't helped in the past; I couldn't help because it was too hard to know what I needed to know to actually help and not just contribute something unnecessary or a double of something or something stupid like that. The other part of the reason was that it seemed like everyone was getting the story moving along well and no help was needed there. I spent a little time in the past couple of days trying to figure out what the current state of the project was and how I could get caught up on it in a way that I would be informed enough to know how to contribute, but really got nothing. I could probably do some concept art or maybe even some sprites, but I've been unable to do so, mainly because of the above reasons.
As far as the programming goes... yeah, I'm not familiar with GitHub and I honestly don't know if I could really help anyway as Steve and most every other programmer on ZFGC are much more knowledgeable on programming than I am (i.e. I mostly just know GML, and very VERY little JavaScript and so little C# knowledge that it's pretty much useless, plus a couple pretty outdated things like QBasic in DOS, and Visual Basic, plus some very minor knowledge on using GLSL for shaders). Pretty much can't get passed "hello world" on anything except with GML. XD
And one more thing: All the resource links and a lot of submission art and graphics are dead links now too. I know that resources have recently begun to get moved, so there's that, but I'm just saying that the whole CP section is a bit too cluttered and broken, and it makes it confusing and time-consuming to try to figure out what is going on.

Did someone say "mini game compo"?
Oho yes! I think the mini game competition is a great idea.
What would be really helpful is if we could start a thread, and - in addition to the rules and whatnot - we would have a section with lots of links to RESOURCES. I mainly just know Spriters Resource, but I know there are more places to get really good graphics, but then there is music and sfx too, and also game creation programs and tutorials for everything from the basics of spriting to various tutorials on things like Unity (and I think I just saw a thread that started and has some stuff like this?).
In addition to links to any/all good resources we can gather, a list of game types to help get people's minds going would be another great idea. My thinking with this stuff is just to remove as many hindrances to developing the games as possible. There are a ton of snack-sized games out there, and they can be used as base ideas to spark a mini game idea. Or maybe just think of a specific item from a Zelda game and make a mini game that is centered around the item. Mini games with the bow are like, duh, but what about the Hookshot? "Hookshot Havoc". There, and a game can easily come out of that. Or even a Sokoban clone with a Zelda dungeon setting, cuz Link loves to push blocks. Very easy to think up stuff. A mini game based off of an enemy or an NPC could go some place too. The monkey from ALttP? Something could come from that. Syrup and her broom. The timed silver rupee rooms that you find in OoT (and possibly other Zelda games that I'm forgetting). Lots of mini game ideas can come from Zelda-themed stuff. I think it would be cool to just stick with Zelda themes for the first mini game compo, but obviously it's up to everyone. I just think it'd be nice to have ZFGC be more... ZFGC. :P

I want to play a game with a Blue Eyes White Ganondorf.

Strangely, all that came to mind for that one was a simple trolling mini game where blue and white Ganondorf is the exact opposite of the normal version. You play as him, and he is always stupidly grinning and prancing along in a horizontal scrolling platformer in which everything is all green and sunshine with rainbows and there are flaming enemies that are trying to set ablaze little bunnies that Ganondorf is holding in his arms as he takes them from one side of the stage to the other side (which is the safety zone where the bunnies are safe for some reason). And that's it. I doubt that's what you had in mind though. :P Oh, and there is a dorky happy-go-lucky version/arrangement of the OoT Hyrule Field theme song that plays as background music..... yeap, someone other than me should be the one to make a game with blue and white Ganondorf, obviously.

Final thoughts with reasons why I think we definitely should do the mini game competition
I already have an actual good idea for a mini game, so I'm in if and when the compo happens. Really need something to warm up my programming skills, so it seems like an awesome thing to do for me personally, and I think it could help a lot of people here to make something small which can become a "stepping stone" so that it's easier to make something bigger next time; something like a fairly standard 2D Zelda fan game. It really can take a toll when you are constantly working on something huge for YEARS with nothing to show, and taking a little time to complete a snack-sized game can really bring up your spirits.

( ehh~ sorry, I talked a lot, and I do try not to bore people to death ::) aw well)
« Last Edit: June 09, 2014, 12:20:29 pm by FrozenFire »
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Mirby

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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #54 on: June 16, 2014, 12:07:16 am »
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Strangely, all that came to mind for that one was a simple trolling mini game where blue and white Ganondorf is the exact opposite of the normal version. You play as him, and he is always stupidly grinning and prancing along in a horizontal scrolling platformer in which everything is all green and sunshine with rainbows and there are flaming enemies that are trying to set ablaze little bunnies that Ganondorf is holding in his arms as he takes them from one side of the stage to the other side (which is the safety zone where the bunnies are safe for some reason). And that's it. I doubt that's what you had in mind though. :P Oh, and there is a dorky happy-go-lucky version/arrangement of the OoT Hyrule Field theme song that plays as background music..... yeap, someone other than me should be the one to make a game with blue and white Ganondorf, obviously.
No no no I think you're the perfect person to make that game. :3
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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #55 on: June 16, 2014, 02:50:56 am »
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My thoughts on the community project and why I haven't jumped in to help

So the biggest issue I see you have here is that you basically can't find anything.  I won't even disagree that looking at the forum is an ugly mess and there's no real good way to be directed to the design doc (which is basically a series of Wiki articles).  The solution for this would be something directing users to said document.  Maybe a stickied thread on the King of Thieves board with a consolidated list of all information that someone interested in the project could look at.

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The other part of the reason was that it seemed like everyone was getting the story moving along well and no help was needed there

True enough, this seems like a positive thing though.  Luckily, group think didn't hit us too hard there and we were able to complete the story arc.

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All the resource links and a lot of submission art and graphics are dead links now too.

Aware and working on it!

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I could probably do some concept art or maybe even some sprites, but I've been unable to do so, mainly because of the above reasons.

This is definitely the most pressing area of the project and has probably seen the least activity.  I would have to update some of the "resources needed" lists for people to look through and see what they want to do.
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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #56 on: June 19, 2014, 10:02:40 pm »
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Meh, I thought I would just throw this idea out - why not right, brainstorming and such. Maybe we could change the layout of the Projects/Resources boards to be more intuitive/accommodating?

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Development
 - Zelda Projects
 - Other Projects
 - Graphics/Audio
 - Discussion
 - Recruitment

Resources
 - Requests/Rips
 - Beginner/Simple Coding
 - Advanced/Complex Coding

Zelda Projects and Other Projects would also contain engines. A lot of the time when people have posted engines, they have posted them into either Zelda Projects or Other Projects boards. Instead of there being ambiguity as to if they should be in Coding or in Zelda Projects or Other Projects, let's encourage engine development. This would also ease up on the project rules with regard to story writing and game features; namely that if a project demo was not too great in terms of its story or game features, essentially this would make it like an ambiguous engine. Addtionally, as you can see I did not include Completed Projects - this is due to there just being fewer projects that meet this classification - and because from an active hobby forum standpoint, project development is more crucial than project completion.
 
I think Graphics/Audio should be promoted up from Resources and combined into one board, similar to Mario Fan Game Galaxy. This should not cause that much confusion given that Graphics topics outnumber Audio, it would mask the low activity of the Audio board, and it would promote creative graphic and audio works as not just being something to use in a project but being something for which creativity/effort was put into that can stand on its own right.

Things like tutorials would not need their own separate board under a scheme like this. A tutorial for a Graphics or Audio style would fit well within a development board. A tutorial for coding would essentially be coding help which would be best in a coding board. If someone had a request for a tutorial that did not exist at the current time, they could post it in Requests/Rips and if the topic is solved (meaning that a tutorial is provided), the topic could be moved to a development board accordingly.

The Requests/Rips board would allow people to still request graphics, audio, coding examples, etc. which would help them out. It would also be for rips of resources from existing games. I think that this distinction would make the board very practical and helpful to have. Additionally, and most importantly, topics in this board could be more ably managed - request topics that get completed could be locked with the solution to the request topic uploaded to the Wiki, rip topics could also be uploaded to the Wiki. There are a few benefits to this: 1) these topics are forum searchable, 2) we could keep track of commonly requested items, 3) we could promote the Wiki, 4) in promoting the Wiki, we could help upload resources to it to help avoid broken URL links.

Finally, I was thinking that Coding could be broken up into Beginner/Simple and Advanced/Complex. This might not be the most ideal division but practically it would be divided between most efforts made in Game Maker / other RAD tools, simple questions/how-tos, HTML, where to start topics --- compared to more "difficult" efforts in C/C++/etc., complicated Game Maker setup questions, etc. Well I am not too sure exactly about this but separating out C/C++/etc. efforts and/or promoting them more so they grow would be beneficial to the forum - and keeping it to where when the coding boards are more active that the simple topics didn't bog down their activity would be nice to have.
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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #57 on: June 20, 2014, 05:04:12 am »
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Wow, I love all of those ideas. Especially the stuff about graphics and audio.

Only thing I'm not sure of is how well it would work to have...
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- Beginner/Simple Coding
 - Advanced/Complex Coding

Just because there needs to be clear distinction, and there are times when it's hard for a person to know if their problem is a basic one, or an advanced one. It might be worth it to have separate child boards for Game Maker, C++, RPG Maker, (insert other common ones here), and other. So it'd be more based on division by programming language.

I dunno. I honestly don't even like what I just said. There's got to be a better way to do it so that it's not confusing while remaining simple and efficient.
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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #58 on: June 20, 2014, 05:52:13 am »
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Thanks! Of everything I said, the Graphics/Audio and Requests/Rips boards would be the easiest to implement, providing the quickest return benefit and lowest perceived drawback. The more prominent of those possible drawbacks would be that users may perceive Graphics/Audio to be less active without rips in it - but I do not think this is a modern issue. The majority of rips for 2D games have already been done, or the ones which could be done would need to be redone so that they are developmentally-useful. The lower perceived activity level in Graphics/Audio would also be at the expense of hiding Audio's low activity level while boosting the activity level of Requests/Rips (increasing the Requests boards functionality to include Rips and other different kinds of resources).

I guess a better division of the Coding board that would make sense in terms of current board content and activity levels would actually be Game Maker versus everything else (everything else including C, C++, C#, XNA, Java, HTML, Javascript, BASIC, etc.). This is to say that Game Maker is so monolithic as to support itself in terms of activity level and that we have enough stuff that isn't Game Maker to support having its own board - that low activity board might seem small but at least it would not nearly be as barren. A simple name would be difficult but enforcing this board's division would be extremely simple.

It could look like this:
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Development
 - Zelda Projects
 - Other Projects
 - Graphics/Audio
 - Discussion
 - Recruitment

Resources
 - Requests/Rips
 - Game Maker
 - Misc. Coding
« Last Edit: June 20, 2014, 06:12:37 am by Diminish »
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Re: What Can We Do To Get More Life Here?
« Reply #59 on: June 20, 2014, 08:24:20 am »
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I guess a better division of the Coding board that would make sense in terms of current board content and activity levels would actually be Game Maker versus everything else (everything else including C, C++, C#, XNA, Java, HTML, Javascript, BASIC, etc.).

That certainly makes sense. Well, I'm totally down for these changes. Of course, it's obviously not up to me. ;)
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